Chatting about games

> gamingshitshow
He's very inconsistent. IIRC he didn't even review the Genma version of Onimusha, which is like reviewing NG1 instead of Black - that game changes so much. If he did, apologies, but I recall he didn't.

> God Hand
The development behind it is golden too, just a golden moment in gaming history that will never happen again. Here we have arguably one of the greatest directors of our era, with his fully trained team that he knows and trusts, that have 11 months of downtime before the next project starts. And they just get carte blance. Can't get anymore pure than that.

> dying
It lowers your difficulty by 1 iirc, but you keep the money you gained which is neat.

> magic pixel
You can never be OHKO'd which is nice, more games should have that.

> camera
Note, use the Roulette to lock-on and then press Triangle to cancel out. Works wonders in more dangerous fights.

> updodge
It's very easy to spam and a crutch to lean on, but casuals tend to backdash for w/e reason.

> GoW1
In general people misremember a ton about that game. It is generally accepted as an easy game, but it really does NOT fuck around, especially later-on. It's pretty hard.

> Astral Chain
It's arguably (imo) the best action game, or one of the best. But ONLY if you beat it, then it gets good. It's so limited on your first playthrough, with constant interruptions, lacking kit and just lacking options. The Challenge Maps in the post-game and NG+ with all the Legions tho....holy shit that's good.

> W101
Note, don't hate it, just cannot stomach the minigames. The core game is fantastic.

> NG2/NGS2
They're both great games imo, just if you can only play one...play NG2.

> KH
Fantastic games, arguably some of the most combat rich and complex games alive. The superbosses in 3 just blew my mind.

> roguelike
I recommend installing DOOM2 and just installing a WAD without looking, technically that's a Roguelike...right hahaha.

>Astral Chain
Tried to get back into this again. Third time and still can't do it. It's not even the mini-games side shit. I find I just don't like how it plays. Not that it's bad, just not for me I guess.

Same with W101. Something about it just doesn't gel with me.

I sold Bayonetta 1 too. Was just never going to touch it again. Tired of Platinum's nonsense now.

Really loving Sifu though. It immediately felt good to just run through a stage beating the shit out of people without interruption.

I've really cut down my backlog by just getting rid of stuff that has annoyed me or not felt good after numerous tries.

Honestly I really just want access to NG Black or NG2 right now.

>KH3
I plan to try this soon. It's the one where you actually start with good shit right?

> Astral Chain
I love this one, everything except the story is amazing and the combat system is very original and works really well. Only thing I didn't like is that the rank system is completely butchered; You can get S+ rank as long as you use as many different attacks as you can, it doesn't matter if you're struggling in an encounter and chugging items. If it had been harder to achieve I would've replayed the main campaign much more, but the game still has a lot of content with the post-game missions so it's not that bad.

>TW101
I like a lot the combat system, the minigames are entertaining for the most part (the Punch Out one is awesome) but as a game it's really, really weak. I think the main campaign is too long, the zoomed out camera and isometric view make it hard to follow the action and gauge the layout sometimes, the platforming segments are awful...But above all, the game does a really shitty job of teaching the player its' mechanics. This is something that is never done well in any Character Action game, but with TW101 having such a bizarre combat system and no practice mode this weakspot is more glaring than usual.
In many games you learn by playing: The level design is done in a way that it teaches you the different uses the game mechanics, proposes situations in which you can practice them and then throws challenges at you where you need to demonstrate some proficiency. In Character Action games you're just taught the button layout and the most basic mechanics and that's it. Well, some games (DMC) do have side-missions where you're taught some additional skills, but they are easily missable or right-out impossible on the first playthrough and they're just not enough. I wish more effort was put into the level design, including encounter and enemy design, so you were taught to use more of your moveset as the game progressed, instead of just upping the difficulty, which has the opposite effort as you just tend to home into a reduced moveset that works for you. Even something like the weapon unlocks in Doom would be a great improvement (ie: "Kill 20 enemies of type X with technique Y").

>the zoomed out camera and isometric view make it hard to follow the action and gauge the layout sometimes

I think camera isn't zoomed out enough. The original version may have been limited by hardware but the port could have had more camera options. Apart from this issue i would say it has the best camera in any character action game or other 3d melee combat game i have played.

>But above all, the game does a really shitty job of teaching the player its' mechanics.

I somewhat agree. The enemy recruitment, colour of enemy weapons etc are too vague But the base game mechanics are explained pretty well. Every weapon gets a cutscene to show its use. Lots of environment bits that require the use of those weapons. The block mechanic which confuses people is pretty obvious for perceptive players. Game constantly throws a lot of new situations at the player which can result in little unsatisfying first playthrough. However the repeated playthrough s are a blast.

I was on the Xbox store.

Tell me if I'm understanding this correctly. There's a category for games with non-white protagonists?

Bought NG2. Will start it tomorrow.

Didn't like a single thing I tried on Gamepass, but that's OK. I didn't buy it for that and got to test a ton of games for only $1.

>category for games with non-white protagonists
Wouldn't surprise me. Gotta pump up that diversity score. Also I doubt there is a single soul that buys games based on the race of the protagonist (not even the virtue signaling assholes that claim to do so).

>bought the GOAT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nirMS6hDd8&ab_channel=BruceSmith
Did you replay NGB on higher difficulties or did you stop at Normal?

>Gamepass
Isn't Monster Hunter Rise on there too? Remember that you liked World.

>Also I doubt there is a single soul that buys games based on the race of the protagonist (not even the virtue signaling assholes that claim to do so).
Yeah it's kinda insane. Anyone who does is actually mental.

Like how does that even come up in conversation? "Oh hey bro know any games where you don't play as white people?"

I've never had a single thought like this and don't know anyone who has. I've been playing games since I was a kid and it never mattered what race I was playing as. It was never considered. The game was either good or bad based on its mechanics or how fun it was (as a kid I didn't understand mechanics so fun was the driving factor).

At least Okami is on the list. Probably for all the wrong reasons though.

>NGB
Only played the original NG on Normal. I'm going to get NGB on the Series S soon but want to go through NG2 first to see if I like it and if I'll become the best player ever. I only ever got to stage 2 I think on the 360. Couldn't keep going because it slowed down at some points to the point it was unplayable. It was actually slow motion. Like I was stuck in Witch Time or something.

>MHW
I did like it. Not anymore. The hideous grind, dumb people on multi-player getting us killed, only game I've ever played where I could play 4 hours straight and accomplish nothing, neverending updates, limited time events, multiplayer designed monsters. Ended up hating more than I liked.

>I've never had a single thought like this
Because you're a well adjusted person.

>I could play 4 hours straight and accomplish nothing
Yeah I heard that the grind was absurd in the post game, much more than the old games. I don't know if Rise fixed the issue but I doubt it.

I probably wouldn't touch it anyway. Don't want go near a multi-player constant updates game that will die and then everyone will move on to the next one. I don't even really like the majority of the gameplay. I just liked shooting stuff with the light bowgun.

Right now I'm busy with NG2 deciding if I want to become the best there is.

>I've really cut down my backlog by just getting rid of stuff that has annoyed me or not felt good after numerous tries.
Even KH1 and 2? If so, sorry they didn't click with you.

>The superbosses in 3 just blew my mind.
Oh?

Right now KH1 & 2 are out.

It's possible they could make it back in. But multiple attempts show they just aren't for me.
I might try KH3 though.

Got the same feeling from GoW. Managed to get through them but didn't really like them.

Now, NG is where it's at. Soon as I started I knew these are my type.
Going through NG2 now.

>could make it back in
Don't feel forced to if you don't want to. Not every game is made for everyone.

>got the same feeling from GoW
I'm mildly surprised, if only because you mentioned that you liked statuses, and petrification is such a joy in GoW1 and GoWII.

So apparently a new Tango Gameworks action game came out today. Same director as TEW2 and TEW1 DLCs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0w8VX8fe1uw&ab_channel=IGN
Aside from the Marvel tier humor the concept seems interesting but maybe too simple/restrictive.
Thoughts?

Looks terrible. But who knows. Heard it will be on Gamepass soon.

Don't touch it unless you get it for free.

>Marvel tier humor
Speaking of Forspoken, I heard it got the old good gameplay/bad story treatment from reviewers. They say the combat gets good near the end (nothing specific, of course), and I've seen the final boss, which gives you that flying power from Infamous 2nd Son. Too expensive to buy on a whim, but there may be a good medieval Infamous hiding in it, waiting to be discovered and talked about in retrospectives years from now. I'm sure that bue skull guy had a "what happun" ready to go before it was even released.

So I'm hesitant to call it bad. Is there any game anyone here just wouldn't play devil's advocate for? I thought the 1st AC's climbing was too slow, as did Ubisoft as they sped it up in AC2. Then comes Whitelight with a video saying "no the parkour's good, actually", and the objective is to climb faster, using walls as steps rather than taking the direct route. Then again, I knew AC had some hidden mechanics, ever since this skill/combo mad from 15 years ago.

Anyone getting the Metroid Prime remaster?

I am. Never got a chance to play it properly.

I have the original so I don't see why I should, but it looks to be a very faithful remake (aside from the visual overhaul which is a bit hit and miss in my opinion). Definitely go get it, it's a master piece.

Finish NG2 first tho.

>finish NG2 first
Definitely.

I don't have a backlog any more aside from PC stuff I don't even have a PC for yet so they don't count.

All my console stuff is cleared. I do have another type of backlog which is all the replaying and mechanics research but that's separate and goes on hold when I'm playing something new.

Prime 1 is the only Metroid game I've played and I love it, been meaning to replay it and also play Prime 2 and 3 for a long time now, but well backlog gets in the way lol.

Raeng, how do Prime 2 and 3 stack up against 1? Not in terms of which is better, but in action to exploration ratio. I think you said Prime 2 has great boss fights, and I think I heard 3 is more focused on the action and less on exploration.

Birdman, are you going to get Fatal Frame 4 remaster? I'm currently playing Hi-Fi Rush but after that I'm finally gonna replay 1 and then play 2 and 3.

> Prime
Prime 2 is way more exploration based, and arguably also harder and more combat elements to it. I'd say it's the best one in terms of those elements alone. It does suffer a bit imo in level aesthetics, the areas just aren't as wonderful as in Prime 1 visually. The dark-world is also a tad boring (just the regular world, but purple).

Prime 3 is far more lineair and action-packed, yet you ironically have less tools (only one gun for example).

Prime 2 has both more exploration and combat elements than 1? My expectations got really high now, sounds like a masterpiece, perhaps barring the dark world.

Prime 3 sounds like a downgrade from 1 and 2, but still seems like a game I'll enjoy, based on one hour of gameplay. The Wii controls work great for it, but I also have to wonder if the game itself suffered due to being a showcase for the Wiimote. As always, I'll reserve my judgement for when I'll play both.

Prime 2 really is an upgrade, but as noted the areas aren't as visually intense at first so it might be dull. Exploration is highly recommended and there's a bit more backtracking too. Combat is quite brutal as well, especially in the Dark World. Bosses are fantastic. It's easily the best 'game' if you get me of the three, but Prime 1 is the better experience imo. MP2 can at times feel like a horror game.

MP3 is fun, for sure, especially loved the grapple in it.

>Fatal Frame 4
I doubt I'll be getting it. Finished it on Wii years ago. Never wanted to replay it.

Has anyone here played SMT3? I heard that this was a pretty good JRPG, so it's on my list of games to try right after FFX. Is it a worthy title?

I've been playing it for a while, but dropped it due to going on holiday and other things came in. It's a fantastic JRPG, really gameplay heavy, ton of interesting systems. Highly recommend it.

Sounds good. Going to add it to my list, then. SBK also talks it up, so if you both recommend it, then it must be definitely worth trying.

Anyone play fighting games?

I used to play them almost exclusively.
Was really into Tekken and SC at one point. Quit around T6.

I think one of the reasons I like the combat system of Chaos Legion so much is the fighting game elements like jump in attacks (attacks that don't stop the jump arc or its movement at all) and counter hits. Or God Hand which has the same kind of counter hit mechanics.

One of the reasons I love Dante's King Cerberus weapon is you get different hit properties if you hit up close or with the tip of the staff. Seong Mi Na does this too. She was my main in every SC she was in (haven't played 6).

Anyway been thinking of getting into a fighting game again but they all seem weird to me now. No interest in SF. Never liked it much. Maybe I should just wait for the next wave. T8 looks to be just around the corner. Hope a new SC comes with it.

I've never played them competitively but they were the first genre I fell in love with as a kid. Played Tekken 3 through to Tag 2 religiously (it's probably my all-time favourite series). My friends were never really into them so I had to play against the AI. Never had a Dreamcast so only got into SC with 2 on PS2, played a lot of that too. I remember 3 was pretty good for single player stuff too, had loads of content. Urban Reign had some sort of "from the team that brought you Tekken and Soul Calibur" tagline on the box, so obviously I drawn to it like a magnet. They had quite a few popular games, of course, but '95-'05 Namco are so underrated. Everyone knows Pac-Man and everybody has played a Tekken, but it's sad that they don't seem to have left that much of a legacy outside of those.

I keep up with modern fighting games but find buying into them a really souring experience. You buy it knowing full well that you'll have to pay extra for another 10-20 characters, which will make up a big chunk of the full roster. When I play fighting games now, I tend to play TTT/MvC2/CvS2 using arcade emulators on PC. It's always fun to jump in and try new team combinations. They still play fantastic and each have a great presentation, true arcade classics for me.

On the topic of Chaos Legion/God Hand, I need to give them a proper run through soon. I did start CL but it kept crashing on the emulator I was using, hopefully that's fixed now. It's funny you mention them as I've been binging YouTube for gameplay of Capcom's action library on the sixth-gen consoles. DMC, Onimusha, RE4, Okami, Chaos Legion, God Hand, Viewtiful Joe, P.N.03, Shadow of Rome, Monster Hunter, Gotcha Force...so many interesting games from a time when big-name studios still took risks on quirky ideas. Such a shame that only 3 of those properties are still relevant now.

Currently playing Fatal Frame 3 and loving it, I finished hour 7 and so far I find it to be the best entry (from 1-3 at least) at everything - Story, exploration and also combat.

So far the ghosts seem to be on par with Fatal Frame 1 in regards to their aggression and agility, and I love how it mixed the additions of FF2 with the charge system of FF1. I like the combo mechanic (especially against multiple ghosts) and the charged shots of Miku.

Using the evade ability when ghosts try to grab you seems to require pretty good timing (also applies to FF2), although it's not as strict as in FF1.

I enjoyed the mission mode of FF2 a lot, but seeing how some missions can take a long time to S or SE-rank, I decided to play FF3 first and only then go back to FF2's mission mode.

T8 isn't until 2024 so that might be a while yet, SF6 is in a few months iirc (june something).

Personally I used to love fighting-games, but online kind of ruined it for me. I always loved playing couch games and going to local tournaments, there was such an energy there. But once online got into the equation and also more and more in-depth training modes, you saw a lot of 'scholars' appear who just crammed all the framedata in their head and it made for some really dull games where it was less about thinking on your feet and doing cool shit and more "enemy does x I do y".

Obviously that's an oversimplification, and I think for the highest level of play it was a boon, but for low-to-mid levels it was super sad. Also tournaments got way less people due to online and a lot of 'local meetups' became "we'll just see you in ranked". And I hate playing random people.

Used to love playing SCII, Bloody Roar and Brawl at local events. Last year I picked up Tekken7 which was fun for a while, but eventually I kind of sank into the online mess and quit. I tend to stick to singleplayer games these days, though I do still play Dead or Alive offline.

>who just crammed all the framedata in their head
This is never necessary. At least not for me.

Just by playing you start to just feel what's fast or slow, what to risk, what you can do after whatever. All that shit.
I knew all this for the character I was good with and all the ones I was familiar fighting with. It just happens.

Like the famous 8 frame jab. I never gave a fuck it was 8 frames. To me it's just 'fast'. You wind up in the same place.

>local events
In my country they barely existed, if at all, so online is actually welcome. If it doesn't lag.

>framedata
Fixating on frame data is like an awkward adolescent phase in a player's development. Plenty of high-level players couldn't tell you frame data if their lives depended on it. Just know which moves are the fast ones and you're good. If you want to know the 'optimal' response to a particular attack, set the training dummy to perform it and test all the likely options. The main benefit of looking at frame data is to find the niche interactions that you probably would not think to test.

>online play
I recommend playing longer sets against fewer people. Either hang out in a lobby, or just match up with somebody and run 10+ games in a row. You can't have real mindgames until you both know enough about each other to make reasonable predictions. The first couple games against a new person are basically just knowledge checks, how does he deal with this, will he stop me from abusing that, etc. Ranked mode is good for training yourself to adapt quickly to new threats, an important skill for competition, but it's not as engaging/fun as a mental fencing match against someone who has learned how you think.

> longer sets
Yeah those tend to be the real way to enjoy, that said I'm also finding most current day active fighting games just not appealing to me. If I play 2d fighters it tends to just be SF2 or SF4, while 3d I go for DoA2.

>current day active fighting games just not appealing to me
I'm inclined to agree, with a couple exceptions. Although if Under Night ever gets good netcode I'll probably drop any newer games in a heartbeat.

>anyone play fighting games
I used to, but never seriously. Didn't even really know about what frame data was until some random guy mentioned it in that context (but that was long after I stopped playing these). One of the games I used to play was Tekken. Everyone mentioning it kind of makes me want to go back to them one day.

Yeah I'm going to need a stick to KBD. Not happening on pad.

Watching some vids of 'high level players' talk is pretty cringe. Like abandoning a character they liked because updates made him not as strong. Tier sluts. Just play who you like and deal.

I usually used GOG galaxy for archiving 5 star reviews. But the steam connection with gog has gone weird, It doesn`t work properly. So I decided to make a Backloggd account and move 5 star reviews manually(luckly,I uploaded a screenshot on twitter at 2020).

Aaaaand Backloggd is under maintenance now.

@Royta/Raeng
Something popped into my head recently. I saw that I have Max Payne 3 in my Steam library for some reason (probably got it with a bundle or at an extreme discount) and remembered that you love this game. Could you tell me why? I've watched some gameplay videos and it seems generic TPS #4562 where you just pop heads in slowmotion.

Secondly, I've wanted to try Death Stranding for a while now, but I was wondering how was the combat and how much is it present during the missions. I've seen SBK talk about it in a positive light but almost every review (including the one from Matthewmatosis) never mentions it and only talk about the delivery mechanics.

I would also be curious to hear about MP3, I played it a couple years ago and kind of just forgot about it.

>even Matty doesn’t mention combat
As much as I like Matt, he has a weird tendency to ignore large portions of games he talks about.

> Max Payne 3
I always consider it the yin to Vanquish's yang if you get me. While you can play the game extremely offensively, there's a huge deal of enjoyment to be had in the game's more defensive play. Max controls like a dream, battles are rough, dangerous, bullets fly in real time, blind fire is a legit strategy and it's cool how you see Max really carry the shotgun in his offhand when using a pistol for example.

The physics and bullet effects make for really cool and memorable personal setpieces. Enemies are pretty brutal too, trying to flank you etc.

It's not a game that shows its teeth on Youtube. Though don't go in thinking it's a mechanical masterpiece either. Just a really fun game. Ton of (arcadey) gameplay modes too.

> Death stranding
Combat happens if you screw up, basically. You have two 'types' of enemies, one are the BTs (ghosts/monsters) while the others are soldiers. Soldiers have more combat options, as you can string them up, ram them, throw boxes at them, distract them with loot, stealth them, smoke them - so much MGS-like ways to toy with them. Sadly you later get a Bo-launcher that literally is an instant-win button, so a lot of players didn't go too in-depth.

You can for example grab a package, throw it at a guy for a stagger, then run at him full speed holding R2+L2 for a battering ram into him. Then run up behind him for a zipwire finisher. Or you can EMP the vehicle they are in and see them wiggle haha.

You can also put a sticky-bomb on a package, then throw that package into a group of enemies and detonate it. Or let them find it (as a trap). Creativity is the limit.

That said...there are more limits haha. Guns are severly punished in this game, as a dead enemy will start a timer for you to burn his body. If you fail, the universe explodes and you get a game-over. So guns aren't that well used.

BT ghosts are mostly avoided or killed with grenades, not a lot of depth to them. With the bigger monsters you can do some stuff like slowing them with your blood grenades, or pissing on them (yes) for a stagger. Later bosses are more RPG spam tho.

Should note that while the combat mechanics have a surprising amount of depth, it really is a package delivery game where the threat of combat keeps you wary.

Death Stranding is at its most fun when it's organic. Like you're traveling for a delivery, something goes wrong, and you try to fix it. You lose a package in a river, your truck runs out of gas or you encounter an enemy amp that is a shortcut to your destinaation. Stuff like that.

>MP3
Noted, I'm very interested. Dunno if I'll be playing this soon but I will keep it in mind.

>it really is a package delivery game where the threat of combat keeps you wary
Sounds good. I imagine that combat isn't rewarded in any way (like in MGS), right?
Also, did you play the Director's Cut? I remember that the trailer for it was more combat focused.

Royta/Raeng wrote:> Max Payne 3
Max controls like a dream

What? This is the worst controlling Max has ever been. Very noticeable input lag. I have never seen anyone criticize the game's combat engine, but someone did and really cut it down. Since this is the elite game mechanics discussion on action games I will post it in the game's thread despite not knowing the author: https://stinger.actieforum.com/t363-max-payne-3#21340

> Max Payne 3
We will forever wonder who that unsung hero is that made that post. Jokes aside, I think it should be known that I don't like Max Payne 1 (couldn't sit through it) so it might be an audience thing (i.e. fans of the series don't like it, non-fans like it). I don't agree with the bland levels, feel they're all pretty cool with fantastic OST. The escorts are minor and rare. And the unskippable cutscenes is just not true. On subsequent runs you can skip them once the game has finished loading. It just loads insanely slow sadly (bad optimization?).

> DS
Didn't play it since I don't own a PS5, but in general you have a bit more tools there but combat still isn't prevalent. Combat is 'rewarded' by having more packages, as most of the looters have packages that you can steal. It's a decent set of resources. You can also just sneak in and steal it all if you're up for that. Again, don't buy it for the combat as it'll be at least 1-2 hours before you have your first 'fight' and it can somtimes be hours in between engagements. Buy it for the experience I'd say.

Not really about max payne 3, but I prefer/enjoyed John Woo’s Stranglehold. I admit that this game is quiet repetitive, but very enjoyable to control the hero, with a bit of arcade elements like power ups. You can grab it on GOG.

Cvit made a video on OZ/The Sword of Etheria.

It's not totally awful. He doesn't shit on the game exactly but is the usual who wants every game to have DMC stuff.

He makes a few complaints but has missed quite a few things in the mechanics (doesn't know slide can OTG, doesn't mention perfect guard, doesn't get what the elements you can equip to weapons do).

I would never make a video without knowing everything. This is basic stuff too.

>DS
I saw that the director's cut was on offer and couldn't resist lol. Also 70 GBs, fuck you Kojimbo.

> Cvit
Honestly haven't seen a single video of the guy where I didn't want to gauge out my own eyes and wish for deaf ears. I'm sure he has his appeal but I just can't stomach it.

> DSbought
Enjoy! The story is quite a ride, it's not his best work (and he really suffers from a lack of editor this time) but it is still memorable to me. Take your time with it and be patient. That said, many players say "finish the first island first, then decide if you like it". Honestly, that's bullshit. You either immediately connect with it or not imo.

Have anyone played "oni" from bungie? How is it? Is it worth to play? If that's the case, where can I buy it + Can I use xbox pad on it?

>Deliveryman Standing
It's Hideo Kojima game of a Hideo Kojima games. That definitely makes it specific enough that not everybody will like it. Kojima was unrestrained when making it, so it has his all signature tropes all over it -convoluted plot, infamous Kojima dialogue lines etc., as well as plenty unique stuff like fourth wall breaks.

It has great aesthetic in huge part to Yoji Shinkawa's designs. I really like Ludwig Forsell's ost. Framing and camera work during cutscenes are amazing. I also admire how they tried to make walking into full-fledged mechanic and not just simple act of traversal.

Kind of disappointed that he is making sequel to it, I expected that after he left Konami he would focus more on making new games instead of sequels, but DS wasn't perfect game, so there definitely  room for improvment.