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101Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sat Nov 09, 2019 5:40 pm

Phoenix Wright

Phoenix Wright
C-Rank
Oh, I see. Thanks for pointing that out.

102Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sat Nov 09, 2019 6:43 pm

Nadster


A-Rank
Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate was the only game I know I played but Generations seems to be good.

103Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:44 pm

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
SMT is NOT Persona.

Persona and SMT are both part of the larger Megami Tensei franchise. But they're separate. SMT is generally considered the "mainline" Megami Tensei series.

And even though it's called SMT: Persona 4 or SMT: Persona 3, that's not what they were originally called. It was just that way in America.
That is...pretty confusing haha!

https://stinger.actieforum.com

104Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sun Nov 10, 2019 4:58 am

Phoenix Wright

Phoenix Wright
C-Rank
@Nadster wrote:Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate was the only game I know I played but Generations seems to be good.
Noted. If I'm lucky, I'll get around to playing this game in 2 weeks from now. Thanks for the suggestion.

105Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:46 pm

Birdman


Moderator
Playing Ni no kuni 1 remaster now.

It's funny, I completed Nnk2 first and didnt know they shared the same world. I'm seeing a lot of connections.

Will make a topic explaining the mechanics when I get home.



106Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:16 am

hedfone

hedfone
A-Rank
@Royta/Raeng wrote:
SMT is NOT Persona.

Persona and SMT are both part of the larger Megami Tensei franchise. But they're separate. SMT is generally considered the "mainline" Megami Tensei series.

And even though it's called SMT: Persona 4 or SMT: Persona 3, that's not what they were originally called. It was just that way in America.
That is...pretty confusing haha!

It is nowhere near as confusing as Super Mario Bros 2 US. or King's Field, where 1 never got released in the US, so 1 is 2 and 2 is 3 etc.

107Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:46 pm

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
Reminds me of this classic video from The Nerd:

https://stinger.actieforum.com

108Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:35 pm

Birdman


Moderator
>where 1 never got released in the US, so 1 is 2 and 2 is 3 etc.
That's happened with a few games. DW for example.

109Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:10 am

5does


C-Rank
@Royta/Raeng wrote:
SMT is NOT Persona.

Persona and SMT are both part of the larger Megami Tensei franchise. But they're separate. SMT is generally considered the "mainline" Megami Tensei series.

And even though it's called SMT: Persona 4 or SMT: Persona 3, that's not what they were originally called. It was just that way in America.
That is...pretty confusing haha!

It's worth noting that a pretty big part of the Persona fanbase doesn't know what MT is. It's one of those rare cases where the spin-off titles end up being vastly more popular than the mainline entries.

110Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Tue Nov 12, 2019 5:23 am

The_Lord_of_Zeal

The_Lord_of_Zeal
D-Rank
@Royta/Raeng wrote:
SMT is NOT Persona.

Persona and SMT are both part of the larger Megami Tensei franchise. But they're separate. SMT is generally considered the "mainline" Megami Tensei series.

And even though it's called SMT: Persona 4 or SMT: Persona 3, that's not what they were originally called. It was just that way in America.
That is...pretty confusing haha!
That's because once upon a time SMT:Nocturne went on to become Atlus's highest selling game, so they realized
"Why don't we do, what Pokémon does?"
And started cash grabbing, by making multiple versions of the same game and naming all their games SMT, in the hopes, that people who love SMT: Nocturne will buy those games as well.
The only games that are SMT are
SMT 1, SMT 2, SMT If (this is the game that gave "birth" to the Persona sub series), SMT Nine, SMT Imagine,
SMT:strange journey, SMT IV, SMT IV:A and the upcoming SMT V and some mobile crap.
Everything else is called SMT, so that they can cash grab.

111Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Tue Nov 12, 2019 6:10 am

The_Lord_of_Zeal

The_Lord_of_Zeal
D-Rank
@5does wrote:
@Royta/Raeng wrote:
SMT is NOT Persona.

Persona and SMT are both part of the larger Megami Tensei franchise. But they're separate. SMT is generally considered the "mainline" Megami Tensei series.

And even though it's called SMT: Persona 4 or SMT: Persona 3, that's not what they were originally called. It was just that way in America.
That is...pretty confusing haha!

It's worth noting that a pretty big part of the Persona fanbase doesn't know what MT is. It's one of those rare cases where the spin-off titles end up being vastly more popular than the mainline entries.
Most of them don't know Persona 1 and 2.
It's kinda like Final Fantasy, where a lot of people don't care about the games before 7.

112Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Wed Nov 13, 2019 12:17 am

Khayyaam

Khayyaam
D-Rank
@Phoenix Wright wrote:Hi, I was told to come here if I had interest in the Tales of games. Is there any game available for the 3DS? It's the only working device I have now, since my PS2 doesn't work at the moment. But if there's any title worth checking out on current gen consoles, you can recommend me those as well, it's just that I won't be able to play these anytime soon.

As far as Tales, the only one on 3DS is Abyss. It's a perfectly fine port, greatly improves loading times but obviously there's screen size issues, and the lack of a second analogue stick means shortcuts are on the touch screen instead, which can be kind of awkward if you want access to more than 8 moves at a time.

As for the SMT/Persona thing... that's always bothered me. Persona is really popular, but obviously it's not for everyone, and people want more out of the series but don't realize they're looking for SMT, which has what they want, because they don't know about it... or, if they do, they think it's exactly like Persona.

Personally, I GREATLY enjoy the Devil Survivor games (both available on DS, both remade for 3DS). They combine Strategy RPG combat with regular turn based combat: if you command a unit to attack an enemy unit, it transitions to a turn based rpg screen where you then give your commands from a menu. The battle lasts for one turn unless you get a Press Turn. It's really cool and interesting, and also greatly replayable due to many story routes.

I also really like the Raidou Kuzunoha games on PS2. They're Action RPGs, though the fights take place on a separate screen, but also they're detective games. There are plenty of times you have to send out your demons to help you solve a case (i.e. send a ghost through a locked door) and you play as them instead.

113Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:48 am

TheFirmament1

TheFirmament1
B-Rank
Glad to see someone else who played Devil Survivor! It's one of my favourite games ever.

114Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Thu Nov 14, 2019 2:07 am

Phoenix Wright

Phoenix Wright
C-Rank
@Khayyaam wrote:
@Phoenix Wright wrote:Hi, I was told to come here if I had interest in the Tales of games. Is there any game available for the 3DS? It's the only working device I have now, since my PS2 doesn't work at the moment. But if there's any title worth checking out on current gen consoles, you can recommend me those as well, it's just that I won't be able to play these anytime soon.

As far as Tales, the only one on 3DS is Abyss. It's a perfectly fine port, greatly improves loading times but obviously there's screen size issues, and the lack of a second analogue stick means shortcuts are on the touch screen instead, which can be kind of awkward if you want access to more than 8 moves at a time.

As for the SMT/Persona thing... that's always bothered me. Persona is really popular, but obviously it's not for everyone, and people want more out of the series but don't realize they're looking for SMT, which has what they want, because they don't know about it... or, if they do, they think it's exactly like Persona.

Personally, I GREATLY enjoy the Devil Survivor games (both available on DS, both remade for 3DS). They combine Strategy RPG combat with regular turn based combat: if you command a unit to attack an enemy unit, it transitions to a turn based rpg screen where you then give your commands from a menu. The battle lasts for one turn unless you get a Press Turn. It's really cool and interesting, and also greatly replayable due to many story routes.

I also really like the Raidou Kuzunoha games on PS2. They're Action RPGs, though the fights take place on a separate screen, but also they're detective games. There are plenty of times you have to send out your demons to help you solve a case (i.e. send a ghost through a locked door) and you play as them instead.
Thanks for your input, Khayyam! I will put those games on my list.

115Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Mon Nov 18, 2019 3:37 am

TheFirmament1

TheFirmament1
B-Rank
Oh jesus. Jumped back into Tales of Xillia again... Gonna have to page you @Khayyaam

- How can I keep my other party members alive? I mostly just end up waiting for a monster to target Elize, and then going after them.
- Any particular artes that I should use for Jude? Which chains into what most effectively?
- Any way to get more TP from using standard attacks?
- Which characters should I use links with for Jude? Any specific way to trigger a launcher from my partner? How can I keep the enemy suspended in mid-air?

116Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Mon Nov 18, 2019 11:24 am

Khayyaam

Khayyaam
D-Rank
1. Keeping your party members alive is... just a matter of keeping an eye on their hp and the battle. Don't be afraid to take a moment to pause and look around, holding the target button freezes battle for that reason. If you're playing as Jude, link with Elize for easy access to the Pixie Heal Link Arte (links off of Healer).

2. I'm not gonna tell you *exactly* how to play Jude, labbing is part of the fun of this game, and when you get the minimum damage skill you can get into fights with weaker enemies for that purpose!

But I will tell you that knockdowns are important in this game and you should aim to end chains with artes that can knock down, though I'm sure you realize that as an action game fan. If you want to continue a combo after a knockdown (not necessarily part of the chain) you use an OTG/restand move... only one I remember from Jude by name off the top of my head is Steel. I used it a lot in my X1 playthrough. Knocking enemies down and switching targets after each, then when enemy numbers dwindle, do longer combos by following up on knockdowns with OTGs like Steel. Not sure what artes you should have at your point in the game though I'm sure you have at least one knockdown move...

3. There's not really anyway to get more TP from regular attacks, if you're really hurting for TP link with Elize (now you have two reasons!) since her link skill steals TP from enemies to give to you (you'll know it's happening because she'll never shut up! "Go Teepo! Sharing is caring."). Also since this is a raw new game and you're still a little early, this IS still an RPG with resource management... so don't be afraid to use items to restore TP (unless you're going for the no item skit). AFAIK Xillia 1 and 2 don't even penalize items since the grade system is based on completion so go crazy. And also realize some fights might not even need artes

4. If you read the above points... you know the answer. Link with Elize. Ideally you change links as the situation calls for it (i.e. linking with alvin when you want to guard break then switching to Elize when you need to Pixie Heal) but Elize just has so many benefits.

If you want to trigger a launcher, use up tilts (up+regular attack in case smash bros. terminology confuses you). Your link partner should follow your lead, especially melee oriented ones like Alvin or Milla. IIRC doing two up tilts in a row should cause Jude to launch then do a jumping attack... at that point Jude's regular air attacks do a pretty good job of keeping enemies juggled ("I won't-fall! I won't-fall!") If you're linked with Milla and you're lucky she may bind them, and some artes can be used in the air as well.

117Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Tue Nov 19, 2019 3:28 pm

TheFirmament1

TheFirmament1
B-Rank
Sorry to page you again @Khayyaam, but I got a few questions about Graces F.

So the dodge system that you described sounds very interesting, and in-depth, but what about the offensive aspect of the combat? Is it "classic" Tales, so to speak, based on directional inputs for one attack/arte each, or is it the system from Berseria of build a combo for each input, and then end up just mapping weaknesses to one button, and spamming that over and over on enemies, and if you happen not to have something for said weakness, you go into the menu, and then remap a button to their weakness, and then just spam that instead?

Because if it's the latter... Holy shit, I'm gonna need some serious convincing.

118Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:34 pm

Khayyaam

Khayyaam
D-Rank
It's neither.

Technically, there's no "regular" attacks and it's all artes... but that's not completely accurate.

The game has two types of Artes: Assault Artes (A-Artes) and Burst Artes (B-Artes). Assault Artes are the replacement to regular attacks, they use the same button as regular attacks would in other games. A-Artes are placed in a tree, like so

Action RPGs - Page 3 1-13A55

If this looks too much like berseria to you... don't worry about it. Berseria is a bastardization of this system. Here's why

The A-Arte tree is not customizable at all. You have to actually learn the moveset. They're not even placed on face buttons, they're Direction + button like the artes you're used to. And since it's set, the a-arte tree follows a logical progression for a combo. There's also Altered Artes- they're not visibly on the tree, but can be used as an extension off of certain A-Artes once you learn them by using a certain input, making A-Artes even more complex. These still aren't customizable.

And if you still need convincing, don't worry, this is only one type of arte. And as I've said before, A-Artes are a replacement for regular attacks, so this isn't gonna be your whole combo.

Action RPGs - Page 3 Maxresdefault

These are the Burst Artes, or B-Artes. Look familiar? It's the classic Tales arte menu. I don't need to explain these, you put whatever artes you want here, and there's shortcuts as well. You can freely chain your A-Artes into your B-Artes, which makes the combo flow basically end up being like classic tales (regular attacks > Artes = A-Artes > B-Artes). B-Artes are for the most part flashier and with more varied effects too... and they have their own altered artes, which adds another layer of complexity that even classic tales doesn't have!

What makes this system interesting is how they interact.

The game uses CC. Since you played Xillia, I can explain that CC is a combination of AC and TP (though Xillia  came out afterwards). Every Arte has a CC cost, and quicksteps cost 1 CC as well. (Free Run also drains your CC rapidly, but you'll quickly learn you won't need to free run *at all*). You can freely chain all actions together until you run out of CC, but unlike Xillia, different artes have varied costs so knowing how long your chain can be is part of the game.

Action RPGs - Page 3 Jcq38Oe

The white number 11 here (as well as the blue half circle) is the CC gauge, so you can easily keep an eye out on your current CC. What makes this interesting, and not just a stamina meter, is the horizontal blue meter on the bottom. That's the crit gauge- you increase the crit gauge by landing attacks, and lose crit gauge by getting hit. If it's full, your next attack will be a guaranteed critical hit, which not only does extra damage, it also deals increased hitstun, restores your CC and even increases your maximum CC for that battle! This is one of the ways you can extend combos beyond one CC chain (though you could also launch or knockdown an enemy, wait a bit to recharge CC, then follow up). Also, once you enter Overlimit mode, CC and crit are completely gone and you can freely chain attacks with no restrictions for the entire duration.

What also makes this battle system interesting is how A-Artes and B-Artes interact. B-Artes don't advance the arte tree. So for example, if you do the first two steps of your A-Arte tree, do a B-arte, and then go back to A-Artes in the same chain, you'll resume where you left off and do the third step of the tree. And that's just on a basic level, each character utilizes this system differently. For example, the main character, Asbel, actually can't simply do A-Artes > B-Artes > A-Artes, he works on a stance system (Assault Style and Burst Style). He starts each battle in A-style where his sword is sheathed and you can only do A-Artes, but by inputting a B-Arte, he'll instead draw his sword (which is its own attack that costs 1 CC so it doesn't break a combo or anything) and go into B-Style where he can freely use his B-Artes... and will have to do the same thing to change back into A-Style-input an A-arte to sheathe your sword (and do a kick if you input a direction during a chain) and go back to the A-Arte tree. This ironically makes the protagonist more complex than the other characters, but it makes it really fun to do combos that switch between styles, especially as you learn skills and artes that facilitate style switching (some B-artes even end with him sheathing the sword so you can go into an A-Arte immediately!). Other characters have similar distinctions between the two types of artes, and learning them is really fun.

And that's basically all I'll say for the game's general battle system without getting into even more specifics, but so far as we're comparing it to Berseria, lemme just say that in Graces F, there is actual set hitstun, combos work consistently, knockdowns matter and OTGs actually exist.

(On an unrelated but more fun note, Asbel's moveset is pretty clearly based on Vergil, while his brother Hubert has one based on Dante, so one of the reasons I enjoy the game so much is it's the closest thing to a co-op devil may cry, though the combat is completely different)

119Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:02 am

Birdman


Moderator
I see a few Star Ocean games are on the Black Friday sale on PSN.

I played SO2 way back in the PS1 days. Never touched 3 onwards. Saw my bro play a little of 3 and I've seen vids of 4 which looks like it has combos and juggles.

Any fans here?

120Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Fri Nov 29, 2019 4:23 pm

TheFirmament1

TheFirmament1
B-Rank
Only thing I know Star Ocean for is the... Uh... "Nappy Time" scene, which is hard proof that God doesn't exist.

Watching that scene makes me want to throw myself out the nearest window.

121Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sat Nov 30, 2019 10:14 am

hedfone

hedfone
A-Rank
Holy fuck that makes me never want to touch star ocean. In fact I bought the ps2 one in an attempt to get into the series, and the horrendous voice acting made me put it down.

122Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sat Nov 30, 2019 11:26 am

Birdman


Moderator
I just looked that up. Not sure what I just watched.

I know with SO4 International you can switch to Japanese. Most likely possible for SO5 too.

The combat looks a bit too chaotic. All I see is lights and explosions with millions of numbers all over the screen.

123Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sun Dec 01, 2019 7:27 am

Khayyaam

Khayyaam
D-Rank
Haha, it's funny you bring up Star Ocean. There's actually an interesting, fairly complex, intertwined history with Star Ocean and Tales... the simplest way to put it is that the Tales of Phantasia devs weren't satisfied with the executive meddling on their game and founded Tri-Ace to make Star Ocean closer to their vision.

That said, stay away from SO4, it's just not a good game period. That's where that scene came from, but it's really just that game. It's horrendous.

Oh, and if you care about the story then stay away from 'Til The End of Time. Good game, but that ending is divisive.

Star Ocean 1 (the remake is coming out on Switch soon!) is VERY enjoyable and Star Ocean 2 even moreso. I have Integrity and Faithlessness as well, but I haven't tried it, and I've heard it was meh.

124Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sun Dec 01, 2019 8:29 am

Birdman


Moderator
What's wrong with SO4's combat?

I often hear SO5 is the worst.

I don't think I'll get these though, at least not right now. I don't want to deal with synthesis.

125Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:11 pm

TheFirmament1

TheFirmament1
B-Rank
@Khayyaam, how would you feel about Tales games giving more technical info in the descriptions for artes, for example, like "70% weapon damage", or "5 hits"?

126Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:36 pm

Khayyaam

Khayyaam
D-Rank
@Birdman wrote:What's wrong with SO4's combat?

I often hear SO5 is the worst.

I don't think I'll get these though, at least not right now. I don't want to deal with synthesis.

Nothing's wrong with the combat in a vaccuum, but I personally felt that regular enemy fights were... basically nothing. You don't get to use any of the unique mechanics like rush combos except for in bosses unless you purposely stall the battles out. I'm not asking for the game to be super hard but it's a shame when basic encounters amount to nothing, doesn't even feel like a resource drain.

@TheFirmament1 wrote:@Khayyaam, how would you feel about Tales games giving more technical info in the descriptions for artes, for example, like "70% weapon damage", or "5 hits"?

In a perfect world they'd tell us everything, but it's not that simple.

As it is now I think they tell us plenty- most of the games have a button that lets you see more detailed info, especially in for example Graces where artes may have added effects like "chance of instant kill" and their properties can change as you play more. I'd love for that info to be out in the open, especially when it comes to things like Arte Mastery, which has been around since at least symphonia but is a hidden mechanic, which is a bit of a shame since even people who are aware of it don't understand it completely. For example, at 200 uses Sword Rain Alpha is cancellable before the last hit, but there's no indication of this.

But the mechanic can be pretty complicated. Sometimes arte mastery can do something more subtle, like just removing some frames of endlag. Lloyd's Twin Tiger Blade is a knockdown that can be followed up by Demon Fang for a combo loop... but it only works after 200 uses. It'd be fantastic if this info was out in the open, but how would they put it? Would the game have straight up frame data, which most fighting games don't even have? I'd love it don't get me wrong...

That said, the games are perfectly fine at giving technical info for skills. The only reason I know for sure there's damage scaling in Abyss' combos, for example, is because the Combo Force skill decreases damage scaling.

This is starting to be a bit of a broad topic but...

The idea of more visible technical info is great, but I understand why these things are often hidden, especially in a genre notorious for people only playing for story reasons. This is more about the genre in general, but many mechanics and technical bits for gameplay are often hidden because if they were taught in a tutorial, the more casual players would just feel the game was too complicated... in fact a lot of people specifically like a game for being simple! So devs put in hidden mechanics to make the gameplay more appealing on the surface, while more technical players would be willing to experiment anyway. Thankfully we enjoy the discovery and sharing our findings... I myself find if I'm talking to a more casual or story oriented RPG player about Tales I have to cut back on getting into technical combat details because it may turn them away from the game for being "too complicated".

If I may bring up another Action RPG as an example of this: not many realize this but Kingdom Hearts games have "double tutorials". (I'm actually writing a deeper analysis of them but I've been putting it off lol). They have one tutorial that explains basic controls and surface mechanics, and once it's done the story starts... but in actuality it just moves on to a "hidden tutorial". It presents itself as an introductory leve/prologue but the actual purpose, game design wise, for these areas is to teach more technical mechanics like revenge counters, parries, crowd control, etc. It does so without any tutorial boxes or explanations, it just puts you in situations designed for these mechanics to happen and cause the observant player to realize something's going on. These things may not be necessary on easier difficulties or for people who'd just grind when they get stuck so they can just advance and see the story, but it's fantastic for players willing to get into the nitty gritty of the mechanics so they could play the higher difficulties and/or built in challenge runs like no EXP. I can't speak for the devs, but I've heard people I've taught these mechanics to complain that the games never even mention them... but then I also think about the people who say they like the games because they're "so simple" and realize that Square's making money off both markets by providing a technical game to observant players looking for them, and making it seem like it's simple for players who are looking for that. That's just an example, same goes for a lot of games period but especially so for RPGs, in my experience.

Bringing this back to Tales, that's why arte descriptions give flavor text with advanced info behind a button instead of both being on screen at once, and also why even with the extra info we don't see things like "slash/thrust stats aren't considered for hits 1-3" or "hold the attack button to add a backstep effect, can cancel before attack connects" (yes these describe actual artes in the series). Maybe they could give us more but I'm resigned to the fact that they'll never give us anything... and I like experimenting and discovering anyway.

127Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Mon Dec 30, 2019 2:54 am

Birdman


Moderator
How does upgrading work in SO3,4,5?

When you upgrade say, a sword, through synthesis or whatever, is it just boosting numbers, or can you attach other attributes and make custom weapons?

I may have asked this already, but I forgot. I keep seeing SO5 cheap but not wasting my time unless the crafting/synthesis offers a lot of freedom.

128Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Mon Dec 30, 2019 10:33 pm

Birdman


Moderator
Also looking into these Etrian games. I think I talked about these already, but was reminded last night when I remembered that the 3DS has an online store too.

I don't like how they're all in first person, but the one called Etrian Mystery Dungeon looks good because you can see your characters. Research showed this is actually another series called Mystery Dungeon.

It's on sale and I'm considering it but don't know enough about the combat yet.

129Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Tue Dec 31, 2019 1:16 am

TaiTsurugi

TaiTsurugi
D-Rank
Be careful tho, the Mistery Dungeon games are not action rpg, they are japanese roguelike. Turn based, the world moves only when you move type of deal and they have the roguelike thing that if you die you start from the beggining.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFWlmU4vDpbsx6v7TMfgtyQ?

130Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Tue Dec 31, 2019 2:51 am

Birdman


Moderator
Yeah I'm aware of those elements. I don't really like roguelike games but as long as you don't lose everything it's fine. From what I've read you only use the progress of the dungeon you died in, and that the dungeons themselves are randomly generated.

I'm interested in the class system and how mixing them up works.

131Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:43 pm

Omega ZX

Omega ZX
D-Rank
Since people have been talking about Tales, I'm here to share my thoughts about the series. I like Tales, I think it's a very special jrpg franchise, but the games I played were a bit hit or miss. However I have yet to play some big ones (Abyss, Vesperia, Graces).

One thing that I should note though is that my approach to the series is more standard, because I like to judge the complete package of story, exploration, combat, music and other things without focusing entirely on battle mechanics. In fact I've never dove super deep into those and played mostly the main character on standard difficulty. However reading about the most advanced techniques here has been really interesting, these games certainly have a lot of depth.

Anyway, here's my ranking from worst to best:

*Tales of Zestiria*
It's no secret that this game is considered worse than the series' average, and for a good reason: it's just mediocre imo, without actual redeeming qualities. The characters are super boring and the story didn't interest me at all. The combat is overly convoluted and I don't like that pseudo-loot system it introduced. The exploration is also straight-up bad, the areas/dungeons are too long and repetitive with bland level design. Music is good tho.

*Tales of Symphonia 2*
This one is mediocre, too. I don't remember much of the story other than I wish it didn't exist at all, although it has some interesting characters. The gameplay is also pretty boring and the whole "use monsters as your allies" doesn't really add anything. The exploration is non-existent, which is still better than what Zestiria and Berseria do.

*Tales of Berseria*
This one had great potential, but ended up being quite a disappointment imo. Still decent tho, it has some cool things about it. The characters are amazing here, and the story is interesting since it's darker than the average Tales, but the middle part is boring. The combat system is interesting on paper, but it's badly balanced imo. Sometimes I can stunlock (which is the main gimmick here) and destroy anything by just mashing buttons, other times I find myself with only 1 soul and it gets really frustrating because I can't even do a standard combo. Too much RNG, it had to be fleshed out better. Also the exploration is Zestiria levels of bad, and the main flaw of the game.

*Tales of Xillia*
But with this we have a massive quality increase, as I think that Xillia is really good. The combat system is amazing here, one of the best of any jrpg ever. The story is also really cool and engaging, I love morally grey villains and this game has a really good one. The exploration is repetitive, but to a lesser extent than what we see in the more recent entries.

*Tales of Xillia 2*
The two Xillia games are really close for me, this one wins but not by a wide margin. Story and combat are even better than the first one, and it's amazing. This game has the best combat I've ever seen in a jrpg, the main character would fit greatly in a stylish action game if he was more mobile (the Tales games don't focus that much on mobility, dodging and positioning, but that's fine since they are jrpgs with no real time battles). The level design is the same as the first game, problem is that there are too few fresh areas, and you're forced to do fetch quests due to a weird progression system that is linked to the plot. So basically, this game reinforces Xillia's strengths and worsens its main problem.

*Tales of Symphonia*
Well, this one is just a masterpiece and one of the best jrpgs ever imo. The combat shows its age, but it's still pretty fun. The narrative is top-notch here, truly a masterpiece and it also deals with some serious and dark themes, despite the light and colourful art-style. This is also the only Tales game I've played that nails exploration, thanks to the old-school world map. Oh, and the soundtrack is outstanding. The only flaw I'd point out is that some puzzles are really frustrating. This game is pretty heavy with puzzles in dungeons, but some later ones go a bit too far imo.

That being said, this was my opinion. A series where we can find great stories, amazing combat systems and beautiful music, but it struggles a bit to nail interesting level design. Let's hope Arise will be a return to form for the series, which has been a bit underwhelming lately.

132Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:34 pm

Birdman


Moderator
Anyone played Metal Max Xeno? It's supposed to have tank customization. I'm looking into it.

133Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Fri Apr 03, 2020 2:09 am

Birdman


Moderator
Played a bit of Resonance of Fate. Weirdest combat and world map I've ever seen.

Got YS VIII. Started on Inferno difficulty since it said enemies move faster.

Pretty much everything 1-2 shots me. Haven't passed the first boss yet. Every attack instant kills.

Don't like having to switch to do different kinds of damage.

Flash guard feels more reliable than flash dodge because you can't cancel into the dodge. Flash guard doesn't have an animation, it's just a glowing circle that appears on the character and can be done even while performing an action. It doesn't give as much of an opening as the dodge though.

134Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Fri Apr 03, 2020 3:05 am

hedfone

hedfone
A-Rank
If you didn't know, you can flash dodge into flash guard to stack the effects. 2:20

135Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Fri Apr 03, 2020 4:48 am

Birdman


Moderator
I have done that a few times unintentionally.

136Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sun Apr 19, 2020 9:08 pm

TheFirmament1

TheFirmament1
B-Rank
I just learned of this game called Akiba's Beat.



Took one look at this, and was like "This is Tales". I imagine that it isn't as polished as an actual Tales game, but I could be wrong. @Khayyaam, got any information?

137Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sat Apr 25, 2020 7:59 am

Birdman


Moderator
Got Crystar on sale. Couldn't find any real info on the mechanics so I have to do it myself.

138Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sat Apr 25, 2020 10:38 am

Birdman


Moderator
This game is almost unplayable.

It has no budget. The animations are barely animated. When you do a sword string it looks like they got still models in each strike pose and put them together.

You have DW style S>T strings that are useless and slow.
Very little ability to cancel. You have to wait until a strike has fully come out.

Basic running is pretty smooth. Not the animation but just how quick it is to turn.

The dash has really long range and you can do them repeatedly.

Enemies are terrible.

There's some kind of accessory fusing but doesn't seem that good.

Someone on Gamefaqs made a topic saying this game is a masterpiece. I'm not going to post what I think of that.

139Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Mon Apr 27, 2020 5:37 am

Birdman


Moderator
Listen.

There will never be words to make you understand.

I beg you, do not touch this game. Do not let my sacrifice be for nothing.

140Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Mon Apr 27, 2020 4:08 pm

TheFirmament1

TheFirmament1
B-Rank
Saw a bit of gameplay, and I think the main thing that came to mind was "What the fuck is this level design"

The sword slashes genuinely remind of DMC2, mainly because of the effect that occurs when you hit someone.

141Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Fri May 01, 2020 1:17 pm

Birdman


Moderator
Playing Chocobo Mystery Dungeon Everybuddy now. I LOVE it.

Fusing weapons and armor let you carry over attributes. I found poison and blind talons then fused with the ones I had on, carrying over the poison and blind attributes. Now I can inflict them on regular hits. This is one of my favorite type of customization.

142Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sun May 03, 2020 12:48 pm

Birdman


Moderator
My wife selfishly took over my PS4 to play Overcooked so I decided to give FF Revenant Wings a try.

I only played the first few missions, but didn't like it. I'll go over why.

First, the way enemies work. There are melee, ranged, and flying. Your characters fit into these classes as well. It's like a rock paper scissors thing. Ranged beats flying but loses to melee, etc. I hate this.

Second, the monster summoning side is nothing like I thought. I should've researched it better. I must have read something wrong.

What happens is you find summoning gates within a level and take them over. You do this by sending units to the gate then wait for a meter to fill. Once full, you own the gate and can begin generating monsters. It's based on some kind of point system.

I hate this. I was hoping you catch them like in Lost Magic then make your own teams. What's worse is the monsters are those 3 classes.



143Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sun May 03, 2020 4:10 pm

Khayyaam

Khayyaam
D-Rank
@TheFirmament1 wrote:I just learned of this game called Akiba's Beat.



Took one look at this, and was like "This is Tales". I imagine that it isn't as polished as an actual Tales game, but I could be wrong. @Khayyaam, got any information?

I've only played a few minutes of Akiba's Beat, so I don't have that much detail to go into but

Yes, it uses Linear Motion Battle System 100%. Me and some friends jokingly call the game "Tales of Xillia 3". It absolutely, completely, apes LMBS and it's great. The reason I didn't play more is that the game didn't seem to have multiplayer. I'll do a deep dive eventually.

But I *strongly* appreciate the game. I don't know how well it apes LMBS, but I think more companies should copy the style not only because I like LMBS but also because I think some competition is what Bandai Namco needs. Get them to realize people want to play games with that system...

144Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Fri May 22, 2020 6:44 am

Birdman


Moderator
I'm going to get FF XIII-2. I heard you can capture monsters.

I completely ignored these as I had gone off RPGs at that time.

145Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Thu May 28, 2020 9:24 pm

Birdman


Moderator
I bought all three FF 13 games. $9 each.

146Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Sun May 31, 2020 1:04 pm

Birdman


Moderator
Gave Shining Resonance Refrain demo another shot and ended up liking it more than my first try. Did some more research and customization of abilities looks good. Going to grab it from Playasia because I can't find a single trace of a physical release here.



Last edited by Birdman on Thu Jun 04, 2020 10:57 am; edited 1 time in total

147Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Thu Jun 04, 2020 10:57 am

Birdman


Moderator
I've only watched videos about FF13. Can't understand the hate for these. They look great and of course I'm going to love the most hated and weirdest entries in a series. What is up with that? It's not something I try to do yet it happens constantly.

So 13-2 is battle monsters and LR only has Lightning as a character? What?

148Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:21 am

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
> 13
I think mostly because it wasn't what people had expected. It was basically another version of FFX in its linearity, but with extra confusing lore. The combat system also took a long, long time to open up. I remember the first 10-15 hours of gameplay being mostly just auto-attack. It really took a while for it to stop giving tutorials and really show its teeth. Once all was said and done you had either already given up, or fallen in love with the game.

> 13-2
Haven't played it.

> LR
Basically an action game from what I know. Very well respected iirc.

https://stinger.actieforum.com

149Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:27 am

Birdman


Moderator
I'll start the first one as soon as I'm done with Blue Dragon though that might be a while.

150Action RPGs - Page 3 Empty Re: Action RPGs on Fri Jun 05, 2020 10:53 pm

Birdman


Moderator
Kingdoms of Amalur is getting a re-release I hear. I skipped this due to reading about too many bugs.

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