Final Fantasy VII Remake

It fixed quite a few things, from the top of my head:

- higher fps
- new difficulty modes
- devil trigger isn't this weird 'everyone now flies' thing
- more costumes
- colorcoding is nerfed
- turbo mode
- parry was made harder
- iirc devil trigger charged faster too
- lock-on (lol)
- Vergil playable in BP
- Must Style difficulty (why hasn't this been brought back...)
- framedata changes on specific moves (too many to note)
- higher damage and agression from foes
- revamped style-rank system

Probably a lot more but it's been ages. Ironically the game was a little bit of a middlefinger once again, as most DmC fans were on PC where the mods were at....yet that platform never got this version haha

edit: https://devilmaycry.org/threads/dmc-definitive-edition-full-changelist.20107/
Here's the whole list, it's quite a lot.

edit2:

> Dmc3
Yeah DMC1 is more of an arcade game, where knowledge-checks can speed it up significantly. Many enemies have very unique weaknesses, like standing on the shadow's spike to open his core or using a shotgun in the spine of those lizards (forgot the name) for an OHKO. It's fantastic in that regard, very deep game. The result though is that an experienced player who is good at managing meter, will just straight up murder through the game.

DMC3 adds a small touch to the DT system, in that if a specific amount of enemies are killed, everything on screen DTs. There are ways around his, once again, but they are far harder to do properly i.e. damage all enemies equally and kill them with an AoE for example. DT'd Lusts with their tracking hyper armor anti-air move are a nightmare.

Malcar: >SBK is STILL living rent-free in his head
Mother of God.

>much higher traffic
Sounds interesting.

>a specific topic
Yes, on the PS5 board.

>never interacted
Probably for the best.

>only got decent because of Duckstation's dev
News to me, but I know of said emulator, and know of its reputation. Wouldn't be surprised if this was true, but as you said, it makes the PCSX2 team look real bad, yes.

>1's are more aggressive
Checks out with what I've heard.

>3's are less so, but they're resilient enough that they have a chance to take a swing
Now I understand things better.

>more for vibes
Trish is an obvious example.

>for one type of DMC fan
We're still talking about 5, right?

>deleted tech from 4
Was it intentional, or was it because they couldn't replicate whatever made it work in 4 (physics engine or something)?

>fortunately for them, this type of fan is the most prominent one
Still, based from what I've heard, 5 seems to be a step up compared to 4 in terms of efficiency.

Shrek: Raeng has you covered.

>on the PS5 board
Will check it.

>Probably for the best
I’ve seen the arguments there and they aren’t the best, to put it kindly.

>Trish
Look how they massacred my girl. Jokes aside, maybe they still needed to get more familiar with the engine. MHRise uses RE Engine and the characters look fine there.

>still talking about 5
Yes.

>intentional
Definitely intentional. They deleted reversals because “players where accidentally reversing moves while playing the Demo”, and inertia was probably for the same reasons (also because it wouldn’t have looked good with the photorealistic graphics, which is also why cancels are slower in 5 compared to 4). Modders reimplemented both in a matter of months.

>5 seems to be a step up compared to 4
Absolutely. Even Nero got some new tricks thanks to the Breakers.

>will check it
It's gotten inactive, so no need.

>they aren't the best
Classic GFAQs.

>get more familiar with the engine
Could be. We'll see what DMC6 looks like... if that'll come out soon.

>MHRise
Did that come out after DMC5?

>yes
Well, if that's the case, then good thing 5 was still an improvement in the efficiency front.

>definitely intentional
Amusing. They should have expected this reaction out of this decision.

>modders reimplemented both
As expected. So you can see if they look weird.

>even Nero got new tricks
Heard he's still inferior to... some sort of vehicle?

>if that'll come out soon
Unless it's already in development we'll have to wait for 3 more years at least (and that's being generous). Dev times have become absurdly long. Gone are the days where a fully fledged sequel could come out 3 years after the original.

>after DMC5
It came out 2 years later.

>should have expected this
They probably didn't care. For them it's better to avoid the confusion for some casual players rather than make combo madders happy.

>if they look weird
I tried them back then (when I still had the combo parasite) but they weren't that weird tbh. Reversals were fine and inertia was less jerky compared to DMC4.

>inferior to... some sort of vehicle
Nico's van?

>already in development
Tall order if they intend to have Itsuno helming the project (DD2). And if they don't, and it has been in development...

>absurdly long
Yes, you're correct. Another reason to dislike modern gaming. Other than tech advancements going to waste on muh graphics or cinematic approaches.

>2 years later
So they should have had more experience, as you say.

>avoid confusion for casual players
True, I forgot that companies nowadays also want to bring in as many 'new' fans as possible.

>had the combo parasite
That right? You must teach Zesty a thing or two if you came out this well.

>less jerky
So pretty much an improvement?

>the van
I think so.

>teach Zesty a thing or two
If Zim and GMG couldn't do it I have no chance with him. I just needed to read some SBK posts to come to my senses back then.

>improvement
It was slower too, but I personally preferred it. It's more of a sidegrade than an improvement.

Apparently Rebirth has a universal perfect block and an iframe dodge for all characters. One guy that I follow on Twitter said that it was Sekiro lite. Don't think it will be that bad considering that those aspects were handled well with Yuffie in Remake. He also said the game has way more interruptions compared to Remake (in the demo at least). How riveting.

>no chance
Who knows? Maybe he needs some words from someone who had been there. But I'm probably just too optimistic.

>read some SBK posts
Same as me, then. Bless him.

>more of a sidegrade
I see.

>universal perfect block and an iframe dodge for all characters
Seems like they addressed one of the meme complaints from casuals. You think this would be a positive, owed to how Remake worked? I've seen No Damage runs, so it shouldn't have been that bad.

>Sekiro lite
Not really sure whether that's a good thing or not. I know this has a reputation for being a 'Simon Says', but I've also seen that the game has plenty of notable strengths. If anything, I hope this isn't about the negatives.

>game has way more interruptions
>this is just for the demo
...You mean more ways to interrupt enemies, or... distractions from the core?

Please don't say the latter.

>perfect block
Very important thing so far though is that the game doesn’t shout “HEY PARRY THIS ATTACK BECAUSE THERES NO OTHER OPTIONS” like other modern garbage. Maybe we’ll see it more later in the game but it doesn’t seem like Simon Says to me.

>iframe dodges
I didn’t even notice this. I’ll have to replay.

>Sekiro-lite
God no. If it was that bad it would’ve been obvious from the demo.

And yes, saying something is like Sekiro is absolutely an insult.

>the game doesn’t shout “HEY PARRY THIS ATTACK BECAUSE THERES NO OTHER OPTIONS” like other modern garbage.
That certainly gives me hope.

>have to replay
So you've been playing this too? What are your impressions so far?

>saying something is like Sekiro is absolutely an insult.
Duly noted.

Also, off-topic, but your avatar reminds me that the person Malcar and I have been talking about (Zesty) has been playing through the MGS series. Just finished MGS1, and he sounded very pleased with what he played. Recently started MGS2 and he says he was blown away.

Really need to get into these one day.

MGS3 is amazing.

@Wright
>I'm probably just too optimistic
The boy is incurable, but he’s 90% there, which is more than enough.

>Bless him
Yes. A shame he doesn’t post as much these days.

>perfect block and doge
They tested the waters with Yuffie and decided to make the casuals happy. I’m not complaining, since it was handled well in Intermission and more action elements are always welcome, but enemies need to be more aggressive in order to keep up (plus not having the obligatory “parry segment” in bossfights).

>Please don't say the latter
How else would they make JRPG fans happy?

>MGS
Fantastic games. 1 is a bit more basic but 2 is top tier stuff. Perfect blend of stealth and action and with a proper higher difficulty setting (European Extreme, which is basically Very Hard+). MGS3 changed a lot of things but maintained the quality of its predecessor.

@Infinity
>doesn’t seem like Simon Says to me
Good to hear. Guess it was just ziad being ziad (the guy I heard it from on Twitter, which very much hates VII Remake).

Yeah when he talks about anything from Japan or with numbers/stats in it, assume he won't see straight. Great guy tho

Birdman: >MGS3 is great
So I've heard. Same as MGS2. Also hear 4 has a pretty strong core, but it has campaign issues.

Malcar: >shame he doesn't post as much
I noticed. Probably very busy with life.

>but enemies need to be more aggressive in order to keep up
Hopefully this doesn't mean having to sacrifice interruptions via statuses.

>How else would they make JRPG fans happy?
You're right. As a matter of fact:

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/264562-playstation-5/80691770/978757042

>1 is a bit more basic
I wonder if it looks that way if one comes from later entries.

>Euro Extreme
The main reason I didn't want to try MGS2 right away was because of the Torture scene on EE, as I feared that would put my controller (or at least the triangle button) in a sorry state. And I knew the game would keep me hooked, so I would want to try EE. So I wanted to try a few other games first.

>impressions
Of Rebirth? I only played part of the demo but I like some of the changes. Enemies seem easier to interrupt and attacks have big hitboxes which I always like. ATB system seems largely the same and Punisher mode seems like an upgrade. The added aerial attacks are a nice addition since the small amount in Remake were a bit unreliable.

And as noted, the parry seems like an addition to the game’s options rather than a replacement for actual mechanics.

>blown away by MGS2
It’s truly a marvel. Even though I like 3 slightly more, there’s nothing like MGS2. Really blows me away every time I revisit it.

>MGS3 is amazing
The remake has me worried.

>handled well in Intermission
Indeed. I shit on parry systems a lot but only because they’re usually done poorly. If they’re implemented well then I’m for it.

>easier to interrupt
In general, or do you have more tools for this?

>added aerial attacks
For Cloud?

>an addition instead of a replacement
Music to my ears.

>MGS2 and 3
I want to know something, now that I'm surrounded by MGS vets. I've heard someone say that the tranq pistol is a bit broken, in the sense that in the majority of the cases, you want to be using just this. Is it true?

>added aerial attacks
And yellow paint. An attack on intellect.

@Roy
>assume he won't see straight
I figured ahahah.

@Wright
>4 has a pretty strong core, but it has campaign issues
4 is like a better version of 3 that you only get to play for 5 minutes. The game is divided in 4 chapters and only the first 2 are classic MGS. Chapter 3 is a trailing mission that ends with an on rails shooting section, Chapter 4 doesn’t have any human guards in it and Chapter 5 is basically a boss rush. I guess most of the budget went into the cutscenes.

>”Games of that length need variety”
Hate this argument, as if combat variety isn’t enough to satisfy players. Also, if devs decided to cut the “variety” those games wouldn’t be that long in the first place.

>looks that way if one comes from later entries
Even in a vacuum MGS1 is pretty simple (but still good mind you). 2 is basically a buffed version of 1 in every single way gameplay-wise.

>the Torture scene on EE
Yeah I remember you mentioning it. Don’t know why Koji made the button mash that insane.

>tranq pistol
On lower difficulties it’s completely busted. Insane ammo capacity, silent, great sleep duration and doesn’t even require you to be that accurate. On EE is still very strong but it’s a lot more balanced compared to the rest of your arsenal (although it’s still heavily required if you want to go for the Big Boss Rank since it requires no kills). Ammo is a lot more scarce, in 3 the silencer gets consumed pretty quickly, sleep duration is heavily nerfed and guards send another dude to check on the one you knocked out pretty quickly.

Also Wright, you should come onto Boghog’s streams if you get the chance. He’s a gamedev and he’s currently making a beat ‘em up. Lots of action game and RPG talk in the chat. There are also other Stinger members in there.

@Infinity
>Rebirth changes
All pretty good so far.

>an addition rather than a replacement
Splendid.

@Birdman
>yellow paint
It’s mind-boggling how people defend that shit. Yeah, some gamers are dumb as a rock, doesn’t mean they should include stuff like this. If people get stuck they’ll just follow a guide.

>in general or more tools
Seems to be in general. I interrupted a few enemy attacks with normals.

>aerial attacks
Yeah for Cloud. Sephiroth has a bunch of anime attacks and he won’t be a permanent member anyway.

>tranq gun
Malcar summed it up pretty well. Very broken on low settings but a bit better balanced on Extreme/EE. There are some downsides to it especially when on EE. Enemies wake up quickly, darts have no hitstun, and typically bosses take up quite a bit of ammo from your already reduced supply. The bosses(in 3 anyway) tend to have organic ways to get more challenging as the fight goes on and that’ll typically happen as you start running out of ammo(The Fear will get hungry and try to replenish his stamina with food or the Fury gets more angry as you do more damage to him).

It should be noted too that these games are designed to be played in so many ways that you don’t need to use it if you want to go that route too. While it’s obviously meant to be a primary part of your arsenal you never really need except for certain bosses on a no kill run.

>4
Absolutely fantastic core gameplay but very little actual game. Chapter 4 doesn’t even have any human enemies and chapter 5 is one room followed by bosses and 2 hours of cutscenes. A real shame since the first two chapters are top tier.

>1 seems simple
It really is. 2 added and expanded on everything in ways that I don’t know how they came up with it all in just a couple years. On top of that, 1 has very few actual stealth encounters. The game is super short yet the second half of the game is still mostly weird set pieces, bosses, backtracking, and cutscenes. It has no where near the lasting appeal or depth of 2-5(as great as it is).

>yellow paint
How else would I know to go the only route that’s available?

Birdman: >attack on intellect
"Accesibility features are always a plus. Always. If you're against them, you are a gatekeeper." - A casual

Malcar: This may sound surprising, but now I realize from which game your avatar comes from.

>4 is like a better version of 3 that you only get to play for 5 minutes.
You had me in the first half.

>only the first 2 are classic MGS
Wonder what went wrong in the other half. And these chapters are super short, you say?

>most of the budget went into the cutscenes.
Shame if this was the case. What could have been.

>as if combat variety isn’t enough to satisfy players.
They only stick to what they're most comfortable with using, so in a way (the wrong way) they're telling the truth, except they're the ones to blame for the monotonous experience they've been choosing to stick to.

>even in a vacuum it's simple
That's the impression I got at first when reading about it. Just that Zesty was very impressed with each update he made about his progress.

>2 is better in every way
And to an absurd degree, according to what I heard.

>Don’t know why Koji made the button mash that insane.
Guess he had to make every part about the game... 'extreme'.

>busted on lower difficulties
>more balanced on EE
I see. Good to have some clarification on this matter.

Also, I heard a tranq sniper exists. How much does it differ from the pistol?

>no kills
Heard you can defeat even bosses non-lethally. A difficult concept for me to grasp, since I have no experience with something like this.

>the silencer
Think I read something about this making the pistol even better. But what I didn't hear is the part about it getting consumed quickly.

>Boghog
Never heard of this person, but noted. And please tell me he doesn't stream in Twitch. Don't like that place.

>other Stinger members
Oh?

Infinity: >in general
Sounds nice. Was this against enemies you could see in Remake?

>for Cloud
Noted.

>Sephiroth
I wonder how casuals will react to getting to play as the katana wielding villain.

>Extreme/EE
On that note, are there major differences between both modes? And for future reference, is EE only available for PAL versions of the game (given the dub name)?

>some downsides to it
So there are definitely reasons to use something else in its place. Good to hear. From what I recall, certain (or all?) bosses naturally encourage you to mix things up as well, which sounds very tasteful.

>fantastic core gameplay
If you got to utilize this for the entire game, would you say 4 could have been one of, if not arguably the best title in the series?

>cutscenes
Are they skippable?

>how they came up with it all in just a couple years
Kojima really is something else.

>1 has very few actual stealth encounters
Oh?

>backtracking
Yes, Zesty mentioned this once or twice.

>"Accesibility features are always a plus. Always. If you're against them, you are a gatekeeper." - A casual
There's accessibility, then there's Yellow Paint. They are not the same.

If I'm gatekeeping, it's of their brain cells.

>I realize from which game your avatar comes from
It’s the red orb from the best DMC of course (if you’re 12).

>had me in the first half
Just like Koji with MGS4.

>are the chapters short
Not really. Chapter 3 and 4 are normal length, Chapter 5 is shorter since it’s a boss rush.

>What could have been
Didn’t play MGSV but I heard that that game also met a similar fate (great ideas/core gameplay, not much "game" to play around with them).

>Zesty was impressed
As he should be. Now he should hurry up and get onto NGII Master Ninja.

>had to make every part about the game... 'extreme'
Note that the difficulty selection in MGS2 is pretty unique. It changes tons of stuff compared to how other games do it, so you’re not wrong ahahah.

>tranq sniper
Slower and clunkier than the pistol but has more powerful shots. It’s mainly used in one section in particular designed around the sniper, and if you want to do a no kill run you have to use the tranq there.

>bosses non-lethally
It’s simpler than you think. Basically bosses have two healthbars, a regular one and a stamina bar (which gets lowered mainly with tranq darts, but there are other methods depending on the fight). You can deplete either one to defeat them, there's not much else to it, but this offers some challenge run possibilities (recognized by the game) and some other methods of offense. iirc certain bosses are defeated faster with non lethal methods compared to the lethal one.

>silencers getting consumed
This mechanic is only in 3, where silencers break after a certain number of shots, and these get lowered drastically on EE. In 2 they’re infinite.

>Twitch
He’s on YT fortunately. I don’t like Twitch either.

>Oh?
Paul Allen is there as well as Aeternal Solitude. I’ve also seen another member but I don’t quite remember who it was.

>major differences
There is a decent jump in difficulty between the two. Guards have a much longer vision range, you have almost half health compared to E, there are zero health pickups (this is the most important change imo), sleep duration is heavily reduced, guards generally take more of a beating and some bosses get more health.

>skippable
Fortunately they are in all MGS games.

>best if you're 12
Have you heard about the cornflakes guy?

>Chapter 3 and 4 are normal length
Which would be...? A few hours in length? Longer than Chapter 1 and 2?

>a similar fate
Yeah, I heard the same thing from SBK.

NOTE: How's Death Stranding?

>Master Ninja
As soon as he completes the GoWII speedrun. Or maybe the RE4 NM run.

>changes tons of stuff
Would you say the amount of changes is pretty much unrivaled compared to pretty much any other Action game?

>mainly used in one section
So the tranq pistol is still preferable overall, from the looks of it. While the sniper seems more situational.

>two health bars
>can deplete either one
Oh, I see. And if you hurt a boss 'lethally' (but don't kill them), would that void the No Kill/Pacifist rule (as far as the game is concerned)?

>in 2 they're infinite
So would you say the pistol was at its best (including all of the add-ons) in 2?

>He's on YT
Thank goodness. I'll check his channel soon.

NOTE: Would you happen to refer to someone who has a pig for an avatar? It seems this fellow hasn't streamed in a while.

>Paul Allen is there as well as Aeternal Solitude
I know both of them, yes. Though I've spoken more with the former.

>zero health pickups
That sounds rather intense. That in addition to the nerfed health. So basically you must do your best to beat the whole game without getting hit?

Other than that, sounds like a pretty significant list of changes. The game definitely doesn't mess around.

>all are skippable
Music to my ears.

>cornflakes guy
I follow him on Xitter, never interacted with him but got into a sort of ""”drama””” regardless. Basically @mageknight14 made a post saying that enemy moveset/AI is more important than character moveset, and I (half-jokingly) responded saying that this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3T_RdUPNg6k (which is essentially the ground zero for combo videos) has been a disaster for action games. Mageknight liked my tweet and Martin (the cornflakes guy) somehow got mad at this interaction. I still remember his meltdown about Raeng, legendary stuff.

>Which would be
Like a 1 and a half hours skipping cutscenes on a first playthrough. Probably half an hour once you’re more experienced (like all MGS games; for example, a full run of MGS2 without cutscenes, if you know what you’re doing, doesn’t last more than 3-4 hours).  

>Death Stranding
Only played very little of it, but it seemed cool. I know Roy thinks very highly of it (I believe it’s one of his favorite game), and SBK was also a fan.

>GoWII speedrun
TRAN KNEE will make sure it won’t ever get completed.

>RE4 NM run
Weird that he still has that run on hold. Then again, since he started working I guess he doesn’t have to drive to stream anymore (or even to edit videos for that matter). A shame really, but good things don’t last forever.

>changes are unrivaled in the Action  genre
It’s up there for sure, but it’s hard to beat NGB introducing completely new enemies and bosses on the harder difficulties and replacing most enemies with harder variants (along with being able to carry less recovery items, upgrades costing more and bosses getting regular enemies to help them).

>sniper is more situational
Pretty much.

>void the No Kill/Pacifist rule
No, the only thing that matters for this is which bar you deplete.
A fun note: you can actually kill enemies without the game acknowledging it. For example, in MGS2 you can tranq the guards and throw them off the ship in the prologue and in 3 you can throw venomous animals at them (which poisons them and kills them) and as far as the game’s concerned you haven’t killed anybody. There are a myriad of interactions in these games.

>the pistol was at its best in 2
Haven’t explored 4 that much and I didn’t play V, so I can’t say for certain, but it’s definitely better in 2 compared to 3.

>I'll check his channel soon
Great. Stinger CHADS will take over the action games discourse everywhere.

>this fellow hasn't streamed in a while
It’s him. He streams frequently but either deletes the VODs or puts them in a separate playlist. iirc his last stream was a week ago where he was analyzing the enemy AI of old beat ‘em ups in order to improve his own game.

>without getting hit
That’s the idea, but in 2 if you stay still and crouch while having less than 25-30% health you’ll recover it up until that threshold. This is especially useful for the final boss since the dreaded torture sequence will leave you at basically no health. Also, if you want that Big Boss Rank at the end you have to lose very little health overall (don’t remember how much but it was quite brutal).

>doesn't mess around
Thankfully GODjima knew that higher difficulties are pretty fucking important in action. Too bad he forgot about it for MGSV.

>DMC3 red orb
Neat.

>Xitter
Kek.

>got mad over this
So the guy hasn't changed in the slightest. The combo parasite really does a number on their hosts.

NOTE: Amusing experience.

>I still remember his meltdown about Raeng, legendary stuff.
So do I, and I concur.

>half an hour once you're more experienced
So you indeed spend a very short time engaging with the core. How very unfortunate.

>seemed cool
I hear mixed takes on it. More or less around the same as the impression MGS5 left.

>TRAN KNEE will make sure it won’t ever get completed.
Unless he somehow decides to do a vanilla speedrun (but no way he can be competitive with the best times unless he grinds it a ton, and at that point it would take him far less time to just do NGR+ NUR+ Clone War).

>Weird that he still has that run on hold.
Very much so. I usually don't like leaving things like that on any game (unless it's a major roadblock, but I doubt NM is THAT bad).

>started working
He was working when he was grinding the OHKO. He just wants to spend his time doing other stuff, like playing MGS.

>NGB is beyond
That right? And here I thought it would be hard to beat MGS in this regard. Simply amazing.

>the only thing that matters for this is which bar you deplete.
Noted.

>killing enemies without actually increasing the hitcount
Amusing. Guess it counts as indirect kills (in a way), even if you were the cause of it.

>Snake tossing venomous animals
If, among those animals, there is an actual snake, it would be pure comedy.

>better in 2
Yeah, that's what it seems like from what I've heard of it.

>deletes them
Bizarre.

>separate playlist
I see it now. Wonder why he just doesn't have them up in public. Either way, I subbed to the channel and set the Notification settings to 'All', so I get to know when he's streaming.

>recover HP by crouching
I see. Does it take a long time for your HP to regen?

>torture sequence being a pain in more ways than one
Absurd. Is there even a checkpoint between this and the final boss? Or a save point?

>have to lose very little health on top of that
Turbo controller it is.

>Thankfully GODjima knew that higher difficulties are pretty fucking important in action.
If only other devs actually learned a thing or two about what matters (including this).

>Too bad he forgot
As you said earlier, a shame that good things don't last forever.

>Neat
Changed the username too. Want to have the same one on all platforms.

>hasn't changed in the slightest
Last time was complaining about people wanting action games with more focus on enemy design rather than combos, saying that the people who have this sentiment can’t “even do 3 starraves in vanilla DMC5”, as if that means anything.

>combo parasite
Truly a Resident Evil tear threat.

>very short time engaging with the core
Compared to 3 very much so.

>mixed takes on it
I heard mainly good things about it, especially now that some time has passed, but it was a lot more divisive on release.

>vanilla speedrun
Could have a shot at it in No Glitches VH (if such category even exists).

>don't like leaving things like that on any game
I got that habit too unfortunately, like Zesty. I have made a list of games that I need to revisit and it’s not a short one. One day though.

>He just wants to spend his time doing other stuff
At least we got the (almost) all trophies run for GoW III Anime Version. I only saw the first live he did, when he didn’t even start the run properly.

>if there are venomous snakes you can throw
There are multiple, and yeah it’s pretty comedic.

>Bizarre
He probably sees them as not that interesting. Also a shame he hasn’t streamed once since I told you about it.

>I get to know when he's streaming
Hopefully soon.

>Does it take a long time for your HP to regen
It’s short enough that you can reliably do it in certain boss fights (including the last one, which is the most important since you start with 1 HP owed to the mashing sequence).

>checkpoint between this and the final boss
Fortunately yes. In MGS you can basically save at any point you have control of the character.

Speaking of FFVII, Rebirth is here and I’m hearing good things about it. Don’t know if anyone here has played it though. Hopefully it’ll come out on PC soon and not in two years.

I'm not prepared to make a big post about it but I'm enjoying Rebirth a lot so far. The open world is a thing and it has similar pacing shit that Remake had but the mechanics are a blast. There were some really nice tweaks made and a couple things I'm not sure about yet(like weapon upgrades).

^ That sounds interesting (the positive, that is). Would definitely like to know more, but take your time.

Malcar: >want to have the same name on all platforms
Understandable.

>last time
Somewhat recently?

>complaining about one of the core aspects of an action game getting attention
Even discarding this opinion into the trash bin would be an insult to the trash itself.

>compared to 3
And 2?

>mainly good things
Most of what I've heard comes from SBK. Not a bad game by any means, but certainly doesn't reach the heights of MGS2-3 (even in what it tries to be).

>a shot at it
As long as one is mindful about the BH crash, certainly.

>got that habit too
Guess people manage their to-do lists differently from one another (naturally). A blessing from only having 6th gen era games (except Xbox) to go through means I'll get to revisit those games I didn't fully explore sooner than later (unless I get the means to play newer gen games by then), such as Okami, Viewtiful Joe, Shinobi, and both GoW games (need to properly do NBR+ and NGR+ in GoW1, not sure if a mix of both will happen, even though what's arguably the hardest fight from both is already covered and out of the way *this without getting into reduxes, but the idea of beating Ares 1 again under this restriction turns me off from it*).

>almost (all) trophies
>almost
Zesty moment.

>saw the short-lived first stream
D'oh.

NOTE: Apparently one of the changes in the JP version isn't even exclusive to that version (it's apparently a port thing *PS3 vs PS5*). Zesty really got scammed when someone started the rumor that the JP version had scaling collisions.

>there ARE snakes you can throw
Pure gold. Can't wait to experience this first-hand.

>hasn't streamed
Such is my luck.

>can even do it in certain boss fights
Oh?

>start with 1HP
Always, no matter what you do?

NOTE: Is this game equipped with anti-turbo controller measures like in the first game?

>there is a checkpoint
Music to my ears.

>save anywhere
That so? Silly question, but could you even do this during boss fights?

>hearing good things
Same.

>come out on PC
Depends on how long Soyny retains the rights to its exclusivity. Can't believe they're still doing this after the whole XVI thing.

Alright, time to talk about Rebirth a little bit. I have just over 20 hours and there's still some things I don't understand but whatever.

I would definitely say if you haven't played Remake, play that first. This game just starts with zero explanation about its mechanics or much of anything in terms of core gameplay aside from the new stuff. And in terms of story(as if anyone really cares) it is definitely "middle of a trilogy" in every sense.

I'll get the bad out of the way. In some ways Rebirth reminds me of The Wonderful 101, really fun and interesting mechanics but bogged down my minigames and other goofy shit. Every other chapter you're forced to play some kind of minigame. Some are harmless and go fast but chapter 6 is basically just minigames for the entire duration and ends with a boss.

The open world kind of sucks more than I was anticipating because there is interesting tools locked behind doing random activities in it. There are materia that(I think) can only be obtained from Chadley by building up enough currency through busywork in the open world. It usually involves fighting stuff which is fine but another way to get the materia other than stopping to do some busywork would have been nice. Also there's crafting which is a thing.

I actually enjoyed Remake's linearity(not the goofy slow paced cinematic stuff) so the open world being a factor every other chapter is kind of jarring to me. Remake had a good progression of encounters and difficulty that I think Rebirth is missing because of the breaks in pacing.

All of that being said, I am finding the game damn fun to mess with in combat. A lot of what was in Remake is here but that have been some changes I quite like. Yes, they did an optional parry; it's not a metronome that you use to react to every enemy attack like in other games. It's good that characters besides Cloud get a reliable defensive maneuver and the game does encourage things like good spacing which I love to see. The dodge is different too but to be honest I don't really understand it fully. When Cloud dodges he also attacks which can clip enemies and pressure them which is cool, but I've also been hit while dodging plenty of times, so maybe the iframes are just not abundant? Not sure.

In terms of some bigger things, there is now synergy abilities too which can be done by building up a separate ATB meter through the regular meter(so if you do your abilities/spells with standard ATB, most of them will contribute to synergy ATB). These are learned through this game's version of the sphere grid(the points used are shared between that and passive/weapon upgrades like Remake had). Honestly, some of these are really fucking cool. There's one I like to use that does a big attack and then grants unlimited MP for both Cloud and Tifa for a short period. This is super useful during boss challenges in the battle simulator where items are disabled. Another one will actually slow down how long an enemy stays staggered for, there's one that grants both characters 3 ATB charges for a while instead of 2, and other ones that have a character take all damage for Aerith so she can do all of her support stuff.

There's also small synergy skills which I really haven't used...they're generally one-off attacks or a counterattack. Haven't used them enough to really get into it.

Obviously anyone who has played the original knows how the materia system works, and I have a great time with it here too. There's a lot of combinations between the characters and links in the equipment that allow for a ton of cool shit. Even some of the more bizarre ones like HP/MP swap are back which I saw somebody say has been useful for his Hard run. I currently have my party setup where Cloud has a good mix of stuff, Tifa is rushdown(ATB boost and the one where she builds ATB on stagger, along with bravery) and Yuffie has other supporting materia. I'm really curious to see how things evolve as I keep playing.

The bosses have been solid so far, attacks are well telegraphed without being braindead stupid and there are a ton of ways to fight them in most cases.

I still have a lot to even scratch the surface of mechanically, but so far I'm very happy with the combat. Hopefully the other shit doesn't make me quit.

@Wright
>recently
Like a week ago.

>be an insult to the trash itself
Combomadders have this constant inferiority complex and they always have to reinforce that “achtually combos are a core of the genre and are super duper hard and cool”. Like, can’t you do your thing while acknowledging that other playstyles are equally (if not more) valid? Do they really need to be the core of DMC despite the fact that they are not encouraged in any element of the combat?

>And 2
Iirc it’s about the same, but in 4 you have more bosses, two on rails section and a couple of bosses that use another combat system entirely (so they aren’t core).

>even in what it tries to be
I guess that even MGS2 and 3 had to come out after MGS1. We’ll see with DS2 when it comes out.

>only having 6th gen era games to go through
Is this a personal choice or a lack of hardware necessary to run more modern games? Either way, 6th gen best gen (and the only essential one imo).

>turns me off from it
Still have to finish GoW I properly but Ares 1 does seem like a slog. Very long fight from what I’ve seen.

>rumor that the JP version had scaling collisions
Imagine that, too good to be true.
On the topic, I find it funny how SMS couldn’t seem to balance these. In GoW I you have the clone war in which they are disabled, because they couldn’t manage to make the family immune to them. You have the inverse problem in II with the TRAN KNEE, and in III they didn’t make them scalable at all because BR would have been too OP. Like they couldn’t find a way to make granular changes to balance these things. Same with the magic and rage orb in II. They should have only nerfed the ones you get from chests.

>Oh
Yep. Most bosses have enough downtime that you can do it reliably. This isn’t Ninja Gaiden after all.

>no matter what you do
Yes, because the torture will deplete your health first before depleting your stamina gauge, and on EE you’re guaranteed to burn through all your health.

>anti-turbo controller measures
Not to my knowledge.

>during boss fights
Yes but upon reloading you’ll get back to the beginning of the fight (understandably).

>Can't believe they're still doing this after the whole XVI thing
As long as Sony pays they’ll continue to do it. They said that Rebirth will be PS5 exclusive until May, but it’s unclear if they’ll port it to PC first. One can only hope.


@Infinity
>minigames
Remake already had too much of this bullshit, but I get it since it’s a remake of VII after all (and they have to make casuals happy).

>chapter 6 is basically just minigames for the entire duration
Riveting.

>Materia
Are these sidequests like the ones in Remake or are they worse?

>I actually enjoyed Remake's linearity
Same. I remember Tim Roger’s review of it in which he mentioned that Hard mode was basically Final Fantasy VII: The Beat ‘em Up, since the game was so linear and with less distractions on repeat playthroughs.

>parry and dodge
Music to my ears.

>Sinergy
So it’s different compared to INTERmission. They probably made a separate meter to encourage the use of your regular ATB abilities, not a bad change.

>I'm very happy with the combat
All I needed to hear.

Are you playing on Normal? I saw that there is an Advanced difficulty level available from the beginning.

>remake of VII after all
It really makes me realize how goofy FFVII actually is.

>sidequests
Some are worse, some are whatever. There’s ones where all you have to do is go fight a few things which is fine, but ones where you have to do multiple minigames are worse than anything in remake.

>FFVII beat em up
More action RPGs could do this.

>encourage use of ATB
I think it works. I’m always trying to utilize all members’ ATB now since the synergy abilities seem really strong. They don’t grant invincibility I don’t think so you have to use them somewhat carefully. On a side note, I’m so glad they didn’t listen to dipshits saying that enemies shouldn’t be able to interrupt spells. You still have to be mindful of when you’re using magic, and there’s variance to it. Some enemy attacks won’t break your armor but others will.

>playing on Normal
I was, but it was feeling a bit easy so I switched to Dynamic where the difficulty stays more consistent throughout. It feels a bit more challenging but I still wish I could try Hard now.

A bit further now. I think this game is the new Wonderful 101. Fantastic combat but the game loves to drag the experience down with random minigames and non core gameplay. Chapter 8 is also full of minigames but has some really good battles in it too. I'm wondering how Hard will be once I have everything carried over and I know how to deal with the minigames better.

I'm going to try to get the other summons. The summon system is really cool but I've only been using the ones from Remake.

>goofy
I remember Dunkey saying that VII is a goofy game with serious moments, while Remake is a serious game with goofy moments.

>enemies can still interrupt spells
Good to know.

>the new Wonderful 101
Oh God.

>how Hard will be
Remake let you skip the bike sequences on replays, hopefully Rebirth does something similar.

>summons
How does it work this time? I didn’t love the Remake system.

> W101 levels of minigames
Well there goes literally every ounce of excitement I had left for that franchise.

>summons
In terms of actually summoning them it's similar to Remake, but it seems like there's a lot more instances of actually being able to do it. It seems like you can do it any fight as long as enough time passes. Other than that they operate the same as Remake once they're summoned.

I'm still not sure how weapon upgrades work. I liked Remake's system because you could shift each weapon towards certain playstyles but in this each character has a sphere grid with passive skills and synergy abilities, but I know that weapons gain materia slots and I have no idea how. I have a sword for Cloud with only one materia slot and as it stands I'm like, why would I ever use this.

The nice things about weapons is that there doesn't seem to be a way to miss them, you find them in very obvious places and then everything becomes available at weapon shops.

Starting to try to mess with other characters more. Cait Sith is fun and actually a lot better than I thought he would be.

>lot more instances of actually being able to do it
Maybe it has to do with the arenas. In Remake Summons were tied to the arena you were in. More open fields = more summoning opportunities.

>sphere grid
Do you have one for the characters and one for the weapons or just for the characters?

>more summoning opportunities
I think this is probably a big part of it. I regularly see the summon bar in normal battles which never seemed to happen in Remake.

>sphere grid
It's just one for each character. So the passive stuff you'd find on the weapon upgrade paths in Remake like attack and HP upgrades are now in the sphere grid, along with synergy stuff.

Infinity: Thorough as usual. Thanks for taking the time to share your impressions with the game. I feared that the open world would get in the way. Just how it is. Hearing this game be likened to W101... not sure how to react (in no small part because I haven't played that either, but I have heard plenty about its strong core, but the other distractions are quite... bothersome). Do you feel this would affect replays heavily?

>chapter 6
No way to skip it? Hopefully Hard lets us do this.

>Dynamic
How do you find the scaling so far?

>new summons
Do tell (when you get the chance).

Malcar: >a week ago
So he's STILL at it? I'm speechless.

>can’t you do your thing while acknowledging that other playstyles are equally (if not more) valid?
I recall this being said almost verbatim in the DMC5 board to a DMCuck.

And I also remember Birdman telling a story of how one from that crowd told Birdman that he was playing wrong with a certain weapon (when their schtick is all about 'player expression'). You can't with these types. They deserve the trolling they get.

>not encouraged in any element of the combat
Be careful, you'll make them explode with such a dangerous truth bomb. Or the fact that Melee, and to a lesser extent, Naruto, does things they wish (and/or pretend) DMC would do.

>more bosses in 4
Do you face more of them with the actual core combat?

>lack of hardware
Mostly this. As I noted, I can play PSP games (such as MonHun) as well. But nothing beyond that. Of course, Wii is somehow easier to emulate than PS2 from my experiences, so that's why I say that PS2 is the limit to what I can emulate. And as far as native hardware goes, I only have a 3DS.

>6th gen best gen
Sure does look like it, but 7th gen also offers a lot of great titles as well, such as Vanquish, EW1, LR, NG2, maybe Bayonetta, MGR, Transformers Devastation, and a few others. To a lesser extent, SWFU1.

>Ares
Yeah, though as noted, it's only a slog in PAIN. The fight lasts for about 11 minutes, IF you play very well (read: if you don't fall asleep while doing the strat). Ares 2 doesn't change at all between runs (maybe for NBR+, but I never block in this fight to begin with, so for me, you can stack every single TUGOWU run type on top of each other, and the fight wouldn't change), and he falls just as fast as he would on vanilla VH.

>collisions disabled during the Clone War
They actually are a thing, but only via knockback and grab reversals. OH collisions don't affect them. Neither affects the family, by the way.

So it's one of two things. They couldn't replicate what they did to make it sort of work in the Clone War, or they deliberately chose to make it so that collisions affected him. If it's the latter... whoever thought it was a good idea needs to be punched in the face.

>BR would have been too OP
I suppose that making it deal half collision damage (but scaling) wouldn't have been unreasonable, given that you apparently can't even deal 50DMG to a single target with BR.

>should have only nerfed the ones you get from chests
Perhaps messing with the base units from something is harder than just the modifiers themselves (for them)? You get 2RP per orb from a BH kill (can get up to 2 orbs per kill IIRC), and 4MP per orb for a Spear kill.

Either way, yes, I agree. Nerfing the orb worth by this much was excessive.

>can do it reliably owed to the downtime
So would you say that the game itself encourages you to do this?

>torture will deplete HP first
Oh, I thought it was the opposite.

>get back to the beginning of the fight
Yeah, that definitely is as it should be. For a second I thought you could abuse this as a save state. If you get damaged during the boss fight, save, and then reload, will you start with decreased health?

>one can only hope
Agreed.

>would this affect replays?
It depends on how Hard/NG+ handles the minigames. Like Malcar said, Remake let you skip the bike section so if that’s how it’s done in Rebirth then it shouldn’t be a big issue. But at the same time, a lot of great games have sections that suck on replays so if they’re quick to get through then shrug.

>chapter 6 skip
No, though I did find that one of the stupid ones I did wasn’t mandatory.

>dynamic scaling
Still a bit easier than I would have liked. Summons are decently challenging as are other bosses but mobs in the open world lean on the side of trash. Dungeon encounters don’t seem have to be designed as well as Remake’s in terms of compositions.

>do tell
I did get Titan and Phoenix but haven’t toyed with them much. Will talk about them more when I spend some time with them.

Very close to the end. Gonna vomit out some random thoughts.

I am placing this game at the roundtable of games that are fantastic when it lets you actually play with its core gameplay, but the developers decided we aren't allowed to have fun all the time. Chapters 10 and 11 are probably the biggest examples of this. Chapter 10 forces you to use Red and Barrett exclusively through a dungeon that felt like an hour, and the boss had some interesting gimmicks but was also really annoying. Chapter 11 can get fucked. You have to play as Cait Sith for like an hour. Mechanically he's actually very interesting, but I don't want to be forced to use him for an hour, and for like 3 bosses, and doing a weird pseudo minigame like 10 times.

I get that this game probably cost well over $100M to create and hundreds of people put a shitload of effort into all of this stuff like designing these characters and their movesets, but I don't want to be forced to play as them for long stretches. I'll naturally try them out if they appeal to me. But I know that most normies don't play around with different systems and mechanics in their games, so they did this so that their work didn't go to waste I guess?

Regardless, I have to give the game a lot of credit for how many enemy types there are, as well as bosses. There are a shitload of different bosses and they have some pretty cool traits to them(there's one that becomes immune to whatever attack type you happen to pressure it with, pretty neat). The game also really seems to reward big offensive pushes rather than reactionary slop like most modern action titles.

I also got some more materia that's really cool. One increases the power of your abilities at a small HP cost, another grants a free item usage without utilizing ATB(I tend to have Cloud and Yuffie use buffs/debuffs at the start of big fights then use the free item to restore MP without taking away Tifa's ability to power up or whatever).

Supposedly the final boss stretch is like two hours long and I'm not looking forward to that. From what I understand there's a good NG+ and a chapter select so that should massively help with just getting right to the combat after a first playthrough. Sort of like a Platinum title but...a lot longer.

I completely forgot this thread existed.

So yeah I finished Rebirth. There's so much I like about the mechanics that I've already outlined but honestly Remake is better. The open world shit, crafting, minigames, and forced party compositions just make me wonder why I can't go through a bunch of combat and do what I want.

You know what's a trend in modern games I've noticed that I'm really sick of? Normal attacks not doing anything. The meter management in these games is super interesting and allows for a ton of options, but also if you have no meter you're kind of just fucked. Regular attacks do next to no damage, deal no hitstun, and don't fill the stagger meter at all. It seems like devs are obsessed with making the cool flashy stuff really cool and flashy but don't want you to have too much fun with normals(because if you're not forced into using stuff then it must be badly designed according to reddit users and other normies).

So yeah, I like the combat a lot overall but I probably won't play it again. I'll just do Remake on Hard if I want to engage with this combat system. I'm also really fucking sick of long games and will probably just get into a bunch of smaller titles for a while.

> normals
This is a trend I'm noticing too, normals seem more like a setup for the larger parts i.e. cooldown moves or specials than being interesting themselves.

That's really all the normals are in Remake/Rebirth. The characters all have secondary normals by pressing triangle that usually help with this a little but they either severely limit mobility, need to recharge, or have other prerequisites like needing to guard damage first, so they don't really function as good normals in most cases.

Damn, I was expecting the game to be bloated but not this much. Did you try Hard Mode to see if the game lets you skip some stuff or are you simply done with it?

Did some chapter select on Dynamic difficulty just to mess around with stuff but didn't go very deep. I'll try out Hard mode soon.