DMC5 General Discussion

I think I should make this now since we are a couple days away. There is also a video on the Final Mission and Boss. So if you want to spoil yourself then go ahead since I don't think it is going to last forever.

Watched Jim's video and saw that V's summons have their own health meters. If they lose all their health, they are out of the game for a while, though he doesn't say anything about how to get them back. Sounds similar to what happens in CL though.

Say an enemy is sent flying by Griffon and caught by Shadow, who juggled them before they hit the ground. Got an OZ feeling from it.

Damn it! Maybe I'm going to buy it sooner than I thought, but I have MHW, AC7 and Curse of Darkness going now.

Currently launching the PC version, GET HYPE!!

It's $130 here. Not paying that.

Two big control complaints I have off the bat. First, you cannot use your buster while locked on, instead you do snatch. Kind of annoying. The second is holding left stick shows you the critical path, and switches lock on targets. Holding right stick turns on easy auto. I have ruined two missions now accidentally turning that on. It completely ruined the first boss for me because it was playing for me and I had no idea what was going on for half of the fight. Devil hunter is so piss easy too, I have to unlock Son of Sparda on the prologue ASAP.

Friend got delayed tonight, we're going to paint some Warhammer but he'll be late so I can at least play a few rounds thankfully. Tomorrow it's full on DMCV day though!

> breakers
This was a big complaint originally when the demo hit too. It's worse in groups where targetting some of the arms becomes a nuissance.

> pressing the sticks
Takes me back to that god-aweful idea in DMC3 to bind "hide all lockon icons" to the left stick. Whatever idiot thought of that... Is there a way to disable it in the setup?

> easy difficulty
Heard about early difficulty unlocks ala Ninja Gaiden Sigma. Is it doable? I'd rather start on SoS if possible. Does the konami code work? I wish games had a feature to more easily unlock difficulty settings other than raw $$$.

A note about difficulty, it will only be hard to beat if you are a masochist to yourself. Exerpt from the trophy guide:


"ow that you have Millions of Orbs you can essentially pay your way through Dante Must Die. Whenever you die, you can buy the most expensive red orb revive and it will take away roughly 30% of the boss’s health bar. Gold Orbs also revive you at full health but don’t hurt the enemy. The red orb cost maxes out at 585,000 Orbs per revive. If Dante Must Die gets too hard you can simply farm a couple million more orbs to make things easier."

Welp. Take that as you will.

Yeah because all the trophy hunters (or those who just want to say they've beaten the hardest mode without learning a thing) will cry if they can't beat the mode on the game they don't even like then cry for difficulty nerfs.

Trophies will be hard though, you have to S-rank all difficulties including Hell&Hell, which is not easy I feel. We'll see!

Supposedly if you beat the boss in the prologue you are supposed to die to, you unlock SoS mode. I am about to give it a few tries. One thing I found out my first try is to reset the checkpoint if he is about to kill you, otherwise you have to do the whole mission again.

Supposedly if you beat the boss in the prologue you are supposed to die to, you unlock SoS mode.

Hey that’s cool. Kind of want to try that. I’m only on the third mission but yeah, devil hunter is ridiculously easy, every enemy just stands around.

I have given it a few tries. The slow mo ball is the only real threat. I need to test if you can take in a breaker, because the movement of gerbera would really help. With the damage I was doing it would take me breaking the crystal three times to beat him. I will probably come back with a stronger nero and do it after I practice and grind out some Devil Hunter.

hedfone wrote:Supposedly if you beat the boss in the prologue you are supposed to die to, you unlock SoS mode.

I can confirm that it works! You also unlock a trophy and a secret "cutscene" of sorts. Nothing ground-breaking, however. I would recommend damaging the crystal almost exclusively with the powered up BR from a safe distance and only moving in when it's safe to do so (or when the boss is vulnerable, obviously). It's very easy to get screwed at melee distance.

PS: As far as I can tell, it's not possible to equip any Breakers during the prologue.


Other random thoughts after playing the first four chapters:

Nero controls really well, they added a very useful Killer Bee-type of attack to his moveset (lock-on + forward + Triangle when in the air). I prefer the new handling of the BR to the way it works in DMC4. Breakers are a mixed bag, but a net positive overall.

The photo-realistic environments can be a bit underwhelming at times, but the frame rate is super solid even on my base model PS4. The usual pros and cons of the RE engine, basically.

Loading times are a bit on the lengthy side, which can be annoying when replaying missions.

Bosses are very enjoyable so far, I think they took the criticism of recycled content in 4 to heart. Good enemy variety, too.

Everything is very polished, I haven't encountered any glitches or broken animations so far. It genuinely feels like a properly developed game, which is very nice.

I like the concept of V a lot, but I'm still trying to learn how to play him properly since he's sooo different from the other DMC characters. My main issue is his lack of immediacy at times given the autonomy of the familiars.

Devil Hunter is not terribly challenging, but the game also encourages careful play due to the absence of healing consumables and the fact that the Breakers are instantly lost if you take damage while using them, which is a fair trade-off I think.

That new move is cool, but split used to be forward and Y now it is back and Y. That has been an adjustment. Also on pc the loads are so fast I can't read the story bits before levels. I am on an ssd as well. I actually wish they were longer or let me button through after the load.

hedfone wrote:That new move is cool, but split used to be forward and Y now it is back and Y. That has been an adjustment.

True. I think this game requires a bit of an adjustment period in general. I'm struggling with the timing of the MAX-Act and pause combos for example. Everything feels so slow in the absence of Turbo Mode!

What kind of commands does V have? Someone told me he has a Stinger input, but no one seems interested in in-depth analysis. Too busy complaining.

I saw a comment that was interesting because I wondered the same thing, which was regarding inputs causing V to move. So say you input Stinger for Shadow, V is going to move as well. The comment said it interfered with dodging but I doubt it's as bad as they say, if it's even like that at all.

Does bring up a concern I had though with how well such a play-style would mesh with DMCs mechanics.

In other action games with summons like CL, there aren't any directional movements for them so there's no conflict.

Looks like I'm going to have to find a copy and master V because it looks like the closest I'm going to get to CL2.

He has quite a few familiar inputs like stinger and pause combos, which work separately for both griffon and shadow, they each have their own dedicated button and a lot of the same inputs.  I think what that comment was referring to about dodging had to do with the summons themselves. V has to use shadow to do a side step, so if Shadow is attacking, you can’t perform it. You need griffon to do a back dash, so same thing if he’s attacking as well. I really like this system so far. V himself barely moves when you input the attack commands though.

There’s some other interesting things to note. You can attack with shadow and griffon at the same time, so there seems to be potential for huge damage, but obviously at the cost of mobility. Also, V’s dodges serve as a way to get shadow and griffon out of danger. I couldn’t find a way to stop shadow from dying during one of the bosses, and it was as simple as just using the dodge tied to him.

I just finished the first V mission. Most of the mission you have no skills, but I bought some and looked at the rest. He has all of the inputs the other characters have forward, backward, back forward, pause combos, etc. It seems like a good player will know what to use when to keep them out of harms way. There is definitely a ton of depth there. You can use DT to power up Shadow or Griffin, or summon nightmare. Kind of like DT explosion from 3. Skilled players won't be summoning nightmare much, if I had to guess. I think the worst part is the crappy lock on, there's no lockon options, and I find it hard to pick who you want to attack. With V it is so important to be locked on correctly to finish off guys, and keep your demons safe.

I've also just finished V's first mission, he's a really interesting character. I must admit I was a little skeptical about him, but I reckon with some practice he'll be a really enjoyable character to play as. Good on Capcom for trying something new.

I'm playing on Devil Hunter (Normal) and the S-Rank requirements seem very generous. I've S-Ranked every mission so far and I've honestly been playing pretty poorly, taking quite a lot of damage.

Can't help but make a few comparisons of V's gameplay to CL.

The way you can get your summons out of trouble by dodging and pulling them back really sounds similar to disband.

Finished the game today (yeah yeah...). Honestly it was a lot better than I thought it would be, but also still a tad messy. I'll keep spoilers to a minimum:

- V feels very very good, but also feels like he could've used his own game. Lots of little functions like being able to recall his allies are missing (you have to dodge to pull them back), he lacks a lot of other minor options and his moveset is lacking. But the gameplay really is the innovation of DMCV which is excellent, had a lot of fun playing his missions.
- the game suffers badly from enemies being designed for one character, and faltering against the rest. Nero and Dante don't suffer a lot from this at first, but V's foes are hilariously outclassed against him. Enemies like those knights with spoiler-names have no chance against you while they are pretty dangerous against Dante and Nero;
- surprised by the difficulty, two bosses wrecked me pretty good on the first run on the hardest setting (Devil Hunter).
- game runs look butter, really smooth
- ranks are in a different scale I feel. A rank is the D rank of DMC3, S rank is something like B and SSS is S rank. You can die constantly, use golden orbs, take a piss and still get an A rank.
- the level design is absolutely dull, there's a few noteworthy stages (like, 1), and the rest are completely forgettable and mash in your head. The art-style of the RE-engine does the game no favours;
- game is short, finished it in one sitting of around 9 hours.
- Dante gets a 'new weapon' at one point in the game that replaces another, and it isn't great. Its moveset is similar, but just different enough to completely catch you off your game.

The biggest note I have though is Dante himself. He plays amazing, but I also feel they really went too far with his complex nature. 4 weapons and 4 guns at the same time is a management nightmare, especially since one of those weapons has 3 weapon forms and another has 2 forms. So you've technically got 9 weapons to switch between and 4 guns. I cannot imagine how badass the combovideos will get, but dear lord is it a nightmare to juggle.

Bosses also feel very..chaotic. Not sure how to do some fights yet since it was basically explosions everywhere. Also going to turn the brightness up now, some fights are really hard to see. Game could really use some color.

All in all I am really pleased though, its a miracle it exists and its actually good. Really feels like DMC4 but finished, better and more innovative.

Lots of little functions like being able to recall his allies are missing (you have to dodge to pull them back),
How fast can you get them back into the action? Can you call them back mid combo/attack?

I figured this would be the case, though I think V is not really a summoner. He can't actually remove them from the field can he? Seems more like OZ where you simply have AI allies.

You cannot remove them from the field, not that I know of. Getting them back into action if they are dead takes about 20 seconds, around 10 if you're standing next to them from what I've noticed (raw numbers, don't take them at face value).

He seems very meter-driven, with R2 filling your DT so it's all about keeping aggro away from you while you charge for your super moves.

Also tried soms DMD-mode, it isn't too hard but enemies pack a huge punch. It is sadly just SoS mode with higher damage values and Devil Trigger being present. But I did get two-shot by a foe, I think a fresh DMD run would be basically OHKO mode.

Two other random notes. The game has a huge tendency to give you a new weapon just before a boss fight, which I find to be really weird.

Finally no-damaged the first boss on DMD. Pretty fun so far, but hectic. Note there are spoiler abilities relating to the ending in this video.

Has anyone experienced the multiplayer at all? I have seen starring constantly DMC Crew which is super annoying, I assume that means you aren't matched. But I have also seen it say various handles. I rated someone stylish but I never saw them I was just being nice. Super weird feature.

Sent from Topic'it App

It is basically in here to put "2-3 players online" on the back of the box in an attempt at false advertisment. They also don't really copy a playstyle, you just see a ranking next to their name at some points. Absolutely pointless feature that will treat us to many "cannot connect to server" pop-ups the second they pull the service I reckon. It taking up a part of the screen also doesn't sit well with me. Wish you could turn it off.

I'm following so many threads complaining about V. I can't wait to play as him. Will I get my CL2?

I wouldn't expect too much. He's a fun character but in every fiber of his being you can feel the words "he's a side character" echoing through your mind. If a whole game was dedicated to him you'd probably have your CL2, now it's just a fun gameplay demo of what you'll never get I fear.

I agree about him feeling like a side character. Unlocking him as a bonus after beating the game may have been better imo, so we could have had more missions for the other two characters. Even though I liked V more than I thought I would, only having four missions just felt pointless. Looking forward to using him in BP though.

Overall I really enjoyed the game, and I have a feeling I’ll end up liking it much more than 4(not like that’s saying much for me). I want to beat DMD at least once before I say a lot, but just a few random things:

-Nero was fun to use, the arms added a lot of utility and freedom to his missions. V is interesting, but as noted before, he feels like a side character.
-Attempting to make use of Dante’s arsenal was fun, but I think a couple weapons I’ll be taking out of the rotation for now, like the hat.
-Even though the game is more complete than 4, I still can’t help but think there just aren’t enough missions. Almost the last quarter of the game is boss fights(some damn good ones, but still).
-Enemy variety is pretty good overall, there were some nice compositions towards the end, even on devil hunter.
-Agree with Raeng about the level design. Every mission tends to be walk down a hallway, enter an empty circular room, win fight, go down hallway smashing red orbs, repeat. I like the environments for the most part but I would have liked some kind of exploration, similar to the castle from 1 or the tower in 3.
-Also agree about Dante’s replacement weapons. It feels jarring to only use him for maybe an hour before some of his moveset gets replaced.
-Getting an S rank with V is insanely easy compared to the other characters.
-The number of good and unique boss fights was very surprising.

Hopefully this doesn’t turn into a situation where the more I play, the more I find serious flaws. But for now, I’m happy with it. Going to try to get through DMD ASAP.

Yeah I feel it is what 4 should have been looking back. Nero feels very well made and DMD's increased healthpool seems to be done to promote smart breaker usage and load-outs. Also surprised that higher settings have less breakers to be found - a fun way of making a stage harder.

Agreed on the bosses, surprising level of quality. Though the later ones do feel a bit more 'you have to play this way' instead of the more open ended design of the first few bosses.

Is there any real strategy with breakers or do they all work on everything?

I've barely looked into Nero's gameplay. Can you combo into other breakers or is there a break animation that prevents it?

As for V, everything I hear about him really sounds like an altered version of CL. Guess I'll have to change his side character status.

Though really he sounds like one kinda like Arcia. Different style but less attack options. Also people are saying V's summons are quite strong which also reminds me of how Arcia has less options but is able to deal with everything in the game with only a few moves.

Bloody Palace will be interesting. If the previous ones are anything to go by, we'll be able to fight stuff V doesn't normally fight. I wonder if he'll be able to fight his own summons? That would be 'Chaos' hehehe.

Btw is this topic spoiler free? I've watched all the cut-scenes so I don't care but do I need to watch what I say?

I have been taking my time with the game, been busy with work. I would keep spoilers in a separate topic.

Just incase mark spoilers or avoid thumbnails / videos that contain them like I did. Or just say "yo guys, spoilers incoming". Don't suddenly go around screaming 'oh my god who would have thought Mario and Luigi were the final boss' or something.

> Nero
You 'can' sort of combo them together but you'd have to destroy one in the process first. Other than that yes you can change them around for fun stuff. Some even combo into each other like Overture's and Punchline's breaker move.

A few notes from me:

- I'm not sure if this game surpasses DMC3, but I think it's gotta be close.
- I felt like there was a real difficulty spike with bosses from around Mission 15 onwards. I used one Gold Orb in the first half of the game and maybe 7 or 8 in the second half boss fights!
- I won't spoil it for anybody, but Mission 18 was awesome. Might be my favorite mission in the whole series.
- I've seen a lot of comments suggesting V is really easy to play as - I must be shit then as he's easily my most difficult character to use. When Shadow isn't whiffing all of his attacks, V is really fun to play as (although manually controlling Nightmare is incredibly dull).
- Cavaliere + Swordmaster = pure fun.
- Anybody have a favorite breaker? I think mine is Tomboy at the moment - not the most useful, but the feedback from using it is spectacular (especially the charged gunshots).

Royta/Raeng wrote:Some even combo into each other like Overture's and Punchline's breaker move.

I didn't think to try and combo Breakers in to each other - do you mean that you can detonate Overture's timebomb attack using Punch Line's standard attack?

So I uninstalled sweet surrender, mega buster, and pasta breaker. I literally never want to use them, so why have them show up in the pool. Sweet surrender completely seems pointless for anyone trying to play at a high level. Like if you are that good getting hit enough to need it would probably cause you to just restart the stage. Also not buying breakers before a stage makes it so much more dull. It sucks that I have to choose between getting new moves, and enjoying the stage to it's fullest potential. Really makes the micro transactions seem super scummy. I think I am just gonna use cheat engine on pc to get infinite orbs and just buy everything. I just want all of the tools at my disposal.

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I'm pretty interested by the fact that bosses get slightly different patterns and moves on Dante Must Die mode, making them a lot harder. Some braindead tactics that worked before don't work anymore and some phase transitions are a lot harder.

GREG

> surpasses DMC3
I think that's the hype talking, but honestly it is a good game in the series and a nice vindication to what DMC4 offered. I'm a bit saddened by the response of the community though, with most just make videos in The Void and not actual gameplay (as we predicted).

> difficulty spike
Noticed this too, mostly in terms of bosses. Actually had to sit down and learn the patterns.

> breakers
I honestly am a bit dull I feel and just prefer Rawhide for its versatility and increased Snatch potential when eh. Well. You know. Not a big fan of Tomboy, I play with inverted camera (thanks Ninja Gaiden) but this also inverts the aiming which I don't like.

> combos
Precisely that, at least that's how it worked in the demo. Haven't tried it here yet.

HED

> sweet surrender
It's pretty handy if you want to S-rank DMD without too much hassle. I still have no clue what its regular ability does other than give the idea what kind of sexual pleasing Kyrie prefers. Sometimes before a DMD boss I just buy 2-3 and break them for max HP before going into a fight. With DMD not spawning green orbs in locations (they are removed) it is pretty handy to have.

> Mega Buster
Pretty decent, charged shot is fun in groups but the regular shot is absolute ass.

> Pasta
A weird Punchline variant.

> breaker system
I'm 'okay' with the orbs (though it feels insanely grindy), but I'm not okay with the massive load times and menu's to change gear setups. I've currently got a few 'presets' finalized and just going to save for 99 of each breaker and get it over with. You can grind massive orbs with Dante later-on anyway.
Still, it feels sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo out of place.

Hey everyone! Almost finished with my first playthrough of the game, I'm on Mission 19 now. The reason it's taking so long is that I'm making sure to grab all S ranks in the process. I'm really enjoying it overall, in fact it might very well end up as one of my favourite games of the generation together with Bloodborne. The fact that we actually got a proper old-school action game which isn't dragged down by a bunch of dubious modern design trends is a miracle in and of itself.


Quick thoughts:

Nero is a delight to play in this one, I'm struggling to think of ways in which he could be improved. He seems really accessible at first, but Exceed and proper Breaker management is key to high scores.

Favourite Breakers: Buster Arm, Punchline and Rawhide. I really like Helter Skelter, Gerbera GP-01 and Overture as well. I agree about some of the Breakers being rather useless. It's unfortunate that I can't uninstall them individually on PS4.

V is... okay. Yeah, he's pretty much a side character. I find that I do either really well or really poorly with him without much in-between. I think he's interesting, conceptually. I'm glad they tried to do something different with the genre instead of relying on the usual "guy with sword". But I also prefer the immediacy of the others, when I press a button which immediately translates to an in-game event. V often consists of sitting back and hoping the randomized AI variables don't screw up. I'm not sure how he can be played at a very high level, but I'm curious.

Dante pretty much pushes the limits of how much functionality can possibly be crammed into a controller. Balrog is the best fist weapon in the series and all of the others are fun as well. My main issue with him are the changes to some of his established moveset. Having played through both 3 and 4 recently, my muscle memory is struggling to keep up with the exact same moves requiring different inputs across all three games. But he's great overall and I can't wait to dive even deeper over the course of the following weeks (months? years?).

Online functionality is completely useless and the game would probably be better off without it. Receiving asynchronous data of another player fighting somewhere else is fine, but I got matched with another player once and fighting enemies "together" is exactly the mess you'd expect. The game just isn't built for this. Thankfully you can turn off matchmaking, which I would recommend.

Bosses are a highlight in both quantity and quality. They certainly took the DMC4 feedback on board with this one. I haven't fought a bad one yet.

Level design is disappointing in both layout and aesthetics. A lot of the later stages are just empty combat arenas coated in a drab underworld aesthetic which channels the worst of NG2 (and that's not a compliment). Although the series is primarily known for its combat, Mallet Island and even the Temen-ni-gru are great locales with beautiful gothic architectures and interesting layouts. 4 and 5 feel like a step back in comparison.

There are a fair few glitches, although it's certainly more polished than the vast majority of games coming out nowadays. I've had issues with using the Tomboy gun function and not being able to see where I was aiming properly because some parts of the levels got in the way. The camera tries to fly away sometimes and I had a progression impeding bug once that forced me to restart the whole chapter.

Plot is my probably my main issue with the game (although I haven't finished it, so that might change depending on the ending). 3's story works so well because it's a simple standalone plot with great bits of characterization. DMC5 reminds me of MGS4 (not a compliment either) in that it tries so hard to be the all-encompassing epilogue to the series that it doesn't really stand on its own merit. I won't go into too many details, but it's clear they viewed it as a fan-service fest first and foremost. The basic plot is basically what I imagined it would be going in and that's a tad disappointing.

The OST is good overall. Devil Trigger is probably the highlight. I swapped Dante's combat music to the one in 3 and never looked back.


Well, that went a bit negative towards the end there! In case it isn't clear, I do love the game despite its shortcomings.

Hey Ksub! Good to read your impressions! It's funny you should mention MGS4, since I had that feeling as well. That said 'final' games are always hard to do. Yakuza 6 was the final title of the series starring Kiryu Kazuma, and it didn't do any fanservice, it was just a totally new story with new characters. And somehow that also didn't feel good (might have something to do with the tale being bad though). In terms of story I still see DMC2 as Dante's ending, he's too powerful, kills the big bad, gets stuck in hell all alone with his bike to murder some demons for the rest of his life. It's a bit dark, but fuck if it isn't great.

> the plot
The last few missions make it worse imo, not better.

> OST
Felt the same, lots of generic wub-wub in my eyes. Final boss themes are extremely forgettable, nothing on the level of Vergil2 from DMC3.

> dante
I'm edging more and more to using a DMC3 setup with him (two guns, two weapons). Fact that you can do this is fantastic imo. He's really great.

Really can see myself playing this game for a long - long - long time to come. Though Sekiro will be a fine distraction.

Royta/Raeng wrote:
> dante
I'm edging more and more to using a DMC3 setup with him (two guns, two weapons). Fact that you can do this is fantastic imo.

Yep, first thing I did every time I received a new weapon was to take out the stuff I wasn't planning on using for the next mission. My brain can't keep up with anything more than a two-slot-system. I'm already struggling with DMC4, so the level of multi-tasking required in order to deal with 4 or more options on each side is well above my pay grade, I'm afraid!

One other thing I didn't mention is the engine, and I have to agree with you that the RE engine doesn't do the game any favours. The photo-realistic look doesn't mesh very well with the subject matter (same as RE2make, really) and some of the returning characters simply don't look anything like their previous incarnations, which can be really jarring. On the positive side, the frame rate is buttery smooth and I haven't witnessed a single drop yet.

I suppose this is the proprietary engine that Capcom are gonna keep on using for the foreseeable future, so I should probably accept it. Just chalk it up to one more reason to despise RE7!

Yeah I played the whole game with 4 weapon Dante and that was a level of finger gymnastics I'd rather not continue on with. It's cool they give the feature though. That said combo videos will probably be insanely boring from now on (just the void).

I agree some characters really looked off, kind of miss the 'anime not anime' style.

So you can equip all his weapons and choose the cycle order?

Used cheatengine to give myself 99999999 orbs. Got 99 of all breakers. Eff grinding in an action game.
I always hated the progression in DMC games, and this one is easily the worst. Who would have guessed lol. I just want all of my options from the get go, this game plays exactly like 4. I know how to play as Nero. Punchline and Buster arm for life!

God Hand, now that's an action game that did progression right.

haha I got it.

Traded in some games I'll never touch again and got way more than I thought. Only ended up paying $9, and I had $10 in credit from when I pre-ordered SC6. So $95 for the games plus that $10 and the game was pretty much paid.

I'll barely able to touch it tonight, but there goes my weekend lol.

Used cheatengine to give myself 99999999 orbs. Got 99 of all breakers. Eff grinding in an action game.
Wish I could do that. Not looking forward to buying everything for all three characters.

Hedfone

I can't say I blame you friend. Note that apparently MTX are a real thing and that they lied, they originally said it would just be a one time DLC purchase but it is full-on MTX I'm hearing. I also noticed when I died it said "or buy red orbs for a free revive from the PS-store". Disgusting. Thankfully you can quickly farm with Faust.

About God Hand, fantastic. Though I must say I felt progression there was a bit off too, didn't like that you had to rebuy moves for higher damage values - that's one thing I'd change of that game honestly. Really poluted the economy in that title.





Birdman
You play as V in chapter 4 and 5, so look forward to that!

I'm actually enjoying playing as Nero more than I thought I would, but I'm having a few minor issues. Nothing that can't be resolved with practice though.

One is I keep pressing L1 by accident and I'm not sure why. I'm losing so many Breakers. Might be due to other stuff I'm playing like MHW or Curse of Darkness which use the shoulder buttons.

I changed gun to R2. Just wasn't working on Square at all.

JCing feels weird and I can't do it as consistently as in DMC3/4. I'm guessing it's the new animations, but then again I haven't played DMC properly in ages.

I find that when I go to buy a move and test it in The Void, I get stuck practicing for ages. Did you do this at all or just go through the game learning?

I haven't entered the Void yet outside of a short Dante test yesterday (had a theory, proved to be false). I just tested around. Few notes for Nero:

- best to keep R2 and Square free, you get two new abilities after beating the game and they fit perfectly there;
- I personally put breaking on Dpad and the gun on L1 since eventually you'll get upgrades that force you to hold it down even longer.
- JC'ing is easier when you find out you can just Snatch (lockon+ O) and JC. You can just spam this until you reach A/S rank in style before you start a fight.

Nero plays a LOT better in this game, air-taunt alone makes him much more mobile. Glad to hear you're enjoying it!

Break on the dpad. Fantastic idea. I totally forgot about it lol.

The JC Snatch is easy but I think the fancy animations are making it harder to JC other stuff like say, single air sword strikes or Caliber because they don't have that instant, snappy animation anymore. 

I'm sticking with the dodge one for now, already forgetting the damn names. It's cool how it does something different from air or ground neutral.

Yeah the mobility is pretty damn good especially with the dodge arm. Only other I've found so far is the electric blast one and I've also got the 3 DLC ones.

Overture is great for damage (the electric one). Gerbera (dodge one) has a great aerial unleash, its ground version is great for casual play but extremely dangerous used regularly on higher settings without a good setup (and even then the damage is lacking). Punchline is fantastic, the best one I feel paired with the one that allows you to grab (forgot the name all of a sudden).

> Gerbera ground attack
You're right Raeng, the damage is so poor considering how crazy the attack looks. It's one I only ever use for fun rather than efficiency.

> Nero's controls
I put shoot on R2 as well, used to that from my control scheme in DMC4. Its absolutely useless on Square when you're expected to charge your gun and your breakers while performing sword combos and jumping. I also use Break Away on the DPad, and put Nero's extra abilities on Square and L1. It's been working quite well for me so far, but I do wonder if there's a more comfortable layout.

On another note, anyone found a good method of avoiding Bemo's suction-attack? I tend to just sacrifice a breaker, but haven't found another method aside from getting behind him.