Chatting about games

I never really liked weapon durability mostly. There were games where I don't really mind it though. Beat em Ups like Final Fight or Captain Commando is fine. It has to go sometime or it could really break the game(I really enjoy game breaking though). CTHD was pretty good with this until that this one mission where it was just baffling. I can't remember the mission number but it was about taking back the Green Destiny. I had a sword in the beginning, so I put it away. I might have used it but the durability was pretty much maxed out. I took a high durable spear and only used that weapon throughout the mission. By the time I got the boss, not only did I not have the spear but the sword had only one durability point left.

Honestly I don't think there are many games with magic durability. Even then I think it is just recharge with gems or money. I don't mind it. In any case, weapon or magic durability is just meh imo. You either repair it just to sell it or use it just to bring it down and you have to repair it again and again and again. If not, then it will either be very weak or broken. That said, it does have its place with survival games. Perhaps if it gets repaired then there should be the extra step so when it does break, it will break slower. I don't mind it but I just don't want to deal with it. Sorry if I sound like a negative nancy.

> Smash
They are all good in terms of content. Smash 4 is pretty solid too. I think Brawl and Ultimate had the most singleplayer content. Melee is the most fun in multiplayer imo due to its speed. 64 is pure janky gold.

> major element
Interesting question. My list probably is going to mirror Infinity's a bit. Let me give it a shot:
Summons: Astral Chain
Weapons: Ninja Gaiden II
Magic: Dark Souls
Camera: God of War 3
Enemy Design: Ninja Gaiden Black
Art design: Killer is Dead
Bosses: Resident Evil 4
Level Design: Dark Souls 1 and Sekiro
Upgrade system:
Difficulty progression: Bayonetta*
Meter usage: Vanquish
Replayability: Resident Evil 4
Simplicity: Shinobi
Grabs: God of War 3
Parries: Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance
Ranking system: Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance
RPG mechanics: Dark Souls
Co-op: Ninja Gaiden 3: Razor's Edge
Versus Multiplayer: Anarchy Reigns
Mission Mode: Ninja Gaiden Black
Survival Mode: Ninja Gaiden Sigma

*  (I'd like to say NGB, but the difficulty scaling was super wack imo)

@Nadster regarding durability:
It tends to feel like padding. Yakuza also uses it for weapons and generally speaking it just becomes busy work. I think what would be better is that they have uses per fight, and then are broken until the fight is over instead of having to constantly go back to item vendors for repairs. Good note on Beat em Ups, I think it fits there since they are pretty much powerhouses. Bayonetta also has a pretty fun system for them imo, very powerful but only for a few attacks while Rodin has all the moves but at nerfed damage iirc.

> Magic durability
Dungeons and Dragons has a system, where you have to prepare spells per day. Once you use them, they are 'done' and you cannot use them until the next day. Dark Souls kind of has this in its spellslot system.

Just out of curiosity, why do you pick GoW3 over 2 for grabs?

Gonna take a stab at answering for Roy, and say the battering ram.

In which I say that's a VERY good reason!

I can't do lists like that. Too many elements apply to more than one game.

>It would be a good idea to play RE4 again

Yep, that's the current plan. I actually bought one out of two things that my PS2 needs in order to fix it completely. All I have to do is find some free time and I will finally be able to play these games.

>ZoE2

Yes, it does sound like a strange game to me... but I might get what you mean once I give it a try.

>Roy

Interesting choices. But what happened to "upgrade system"?

Whoops, forgot about Upgrade System. Couldn't think of a good example sadly haha.

> Grabs in God of War
Battering Ram yeah, paired with the wallpin options that game offered. Really added a lot to the formula imo. Firma knows me well.

https://www.siliconera.com/mario-galaxy-remaster-rumor/

Supposedly the 3D Marios are coming to switch. Can’t even explain how hyped I am if this is true, legendary games.

I saw that rumor too, but I am very sceptical. 3 Mario remasters bundled together? This is Nintendo we're talking about, I assume they will be seperate releases at 69,99$ and we'll be grateful haha. Though that being said, they have done a select few limited run collections in the past i.e. Metroid Prime Trilogy. I'l wait until there's a reveal. Most are absolutely must-plays though, and with 3d World on the Switch that leaves just Devil's Third as a reason for the WiiU to be hooked up permanently...that and Golden Sun. God damnit Nintendo.

I expect them to be in packs, I.E 64 and sunshine in one for full price, Galaxy 1 and 2 in another, enhanced 3D world by itself. Yeah if this ends up being true then the WiiU is really about to be obsolete.

I'm skeptical as well, but for different reasons. To be specific,the fact that it's almost April 1st (maybe for some people it's already April 1st). It's funny, but we don't even celebrate that specific day here (at least not on April 1st), so it's easy for me to fall for pranks sometimes.

More and more notes coming in about that, yes, Resident Evil 4 is next in line for a remake. I don't know what the devil is going through Capcom's heads right now, and I will keep an open mind, but damn. This game will - day 1 - be compared to one of the greatest games ever made. This is a tall fucking order. I do not envy this remake's designers. If they stray from the script too much, they're damned, if they don't make it as good as the original, a nigh impossible task, they're damned too.

I'm half surprised Capcom isn't just going to re-release RE4 until the day that I die.

EDIT: apparently, Mikami was almost involved. The studio, M-Two, was offered to him personally. But he refused, wanting to stick to Tango.

It's going to have dual analogue controls and a completely generic combat flow, isn't it? Not to mention a soulless pseudo-serious script and only half of the original content to make room for all those precious RE Engine textures.

Not looking forward to all the uninformed sycophantic praise coming from folks without any understanding of what makes the original so brilliant.

^^ Dang, ninja'd.

Was about to post this:

https://www.videogameschronicle.com/news/resident-evil-4-remake/

Oh for the love of God...seriously, Capcom? I was on board with RE2make, as flawed as it turned out being, but with RE3 cutting so much and being an RE2 reskin, there’s no way this will end well. Can’t wait for this remake to have:

-Homing grab enemies
-Enemies that no longer have different weapons
-No bugs, garradors, plagas, or El Gigantes
-Half of the castle and island cut
-The entire underground mine areas cut
-Most of the weapons gone, especially the mine thrower
-Moving and shooting which kills how RE4 handled its body part-specific shooting and buffer enemies have when approaching the player
-Removed melee
-Knife nerfed into oblivion
-Shop overhauled for the worse
-Walk and talk sections to mess with the pace
-Severly decreased enemy counts
-Mercenaries and Assignment Ada probably gone

Ugh. I’m sorry but I can’t be positive about this at all. Awful idea.

Unsurprisingly, the crowd that didn't learn how to play the game (iT'S clUnkY) is showing up in full-force.

I'm usually trying not to contribute to the culture of negativity and trolling when it comes to online gaming discourse, but man... Moments like this make it pretty difficult.

I think Infinity's predictions are right on the money and that they are going to completely fuck it up, in all likelihood.

To me, RE4 is damn near the perfect package. It nailed almost everything I could’ve asked for in a single game: phenomenal, innovative mechanics, almost flawless pacing, endless replay value, great artwork, haunting soundtrack, secrets/unlockables/challenges galore, everything you could ask for.

The possibility of messing up a game like this isn’t just high: it’s outright unavoidable. This can’t be redone by another team. Hell, I don’t even think Mikami and the team would properly do it. It just needs left alone!

I would be on-board with a Bluepoint-style graphical overhaul, but that's probably not what they have in mind, unfortunately.

The only mechanical room for improvement I can think of would be to add a dedicated grenade aim shoulder button that cycles through all three types when "reloading". It would remove one layer of unnecessary inventory interaction and would benefit speedruns by way of instant-tapping your way into a faster running speed.

That's it. In all my years of playing this game, it's about the only element that I would add / change. I can't think of anything else (apart from online Mercs leaderboards). The game is almost perfectly designed otherwise.

Screw this.

Think you're all pretty on the mark. I was going to make a list of my predictions worst case scenario, but what you guys posted is pretty much that.

At best, what I expect is a decent third-person shooter in the village of Resident Evil 4. We'll get to explore the town a bit more, which will probably not be in Spain anymore (probably somewhere in America, a weird town). Honestly, I hope it does just that. Focus more on the town, how people transformed, that whole underground cult element. You're never going to top the original, so go a completely difference path I'd say. Just have the only connection be the title and the protagonist. Make the rest fresh.

@Infinity

You're very generous in saying just the mines are cut.

NOTE: this whole thing has got me to notice once again just how ahead of its time RE4 was, but also still is ahead of its time. How its enemies had body-reactions based on where they were shot with specific gameplay consequences, how they'd hoard you, block their eyes from the laser-sight, dodge the laser, their different weapons, that you could disarm them - there were so many little gameplay elements that just work but also give so much immersion. Fantastic.

> It's clunky
These people would sell their parents to the devil if IGN told them so. It's why I fully predict that God of War 2018 will be ripped to shreds when its sequel comes around. "So much better than that flawed and clunky game with a bad story, this, this game. This game has a good story". The only way to hype the new is to bash the old, and that's not a good sign going forward.


> improvements
I'd still have a few I'd love to see if we're talking a fictional RE4+.

• add the boomerjacket as an unlockable;
  
• mercs playable in the campaign when they've gotten 5 stars on all their missions;
  
• a difficulty higher than Pro that remixes enemies in wacky ways (give me Knights in the village);
  
• a grenade-button is a good idea;
  
• honestly, change some of the Island sections. I never liked the Castle but I can't deny its brilliance. The Island is just too dull for me and has some really boring sections.
  
• completely redo Seperate Ways to offer a unique experience instead of a nerfed RE4 with bad rehashed levels;
  
• slightly change the platforms during the Salazar fight so that you can Knife him;
  
• unlock the minethrower earlier, it's such a novel weapon and gets too little time to shine imo;
  
• retweak the balance between the shotguns. They are the only ones that aren't all viable in the end;
  
• retweak the balance between melee attacks. The knee-kick is a single target attack and should deal more damage imo, while the spin-kick should deal less damage. Just a minor numbers change;
  
• "Overtime" mini-game
  
• Add Luis to Mercenaries, no clue why he was absent;
  

One thing I keep wondering about is Ashley. I always wanted her gone, but I can't help but feel that a game without her present would be a lot worse. Wonder how they're going to do her in this modern era where a man can't defend a woman.

>Ashley
Well, the whole trend of "dad protects their kid/kid surrogate" is still pretty in right now. Last of Us, Evil Within 2, and Bioshock Infinite all fit firmly in that mold.

Of course, that likely means that it's gonna turn from a more brother/sister dynamic to a parent/child dynamic, which... Uh... Yeah, that's not what I would expect from Leon.

Infinity_Divide wrote:endless replay value

I still haven't gotten round to playing RE4, but I often see it praised for it's replay value. What makes it so good in this regard?

Gregorinho wrote:
I still haven't gotten round to playing RE4, but I often see it praised for it's replay value. What makes it so good in this regard?

For me, it's because the game never really falls into the habit of so many action games of simply locking you inside an empty arena with a bunch of enemies and letting you engage with the combat in a vacuum. Every single area is meticulously designed and has its own flow and specific encounter design. The game never really "settles" on any specific gameplay loop, the experience is being kept fresh throughout by constantly remixing all of its different enemies and scenarios in creative ways. As soon as you learn how to deal with a specific threat, the game throws a curve ball at you, usually in the form of another enemy type, another weapon, or another area-specific element that forces you to re-think the way you approach things. I could go into more details, but I actually think it would be best for you to experience it for yourself!


In other words, the moment-to-moment gameplay variety is staggering for something with such simple and easily understandable fundamentals. Add to that the fantastic bosses, all of whom provide a different gameplay experience without ever being passively "cinematic" or cheap; and the great weapons that reward experimentation and multiple playthroughs since you are more or less forced to focus on a select few every time.


Oh, and... Mercs, of course!

It is one of those rare games that's just a good replay, without really offering anything in return other than good gameplay. I'd like to add to Ksub's good description, that the game also is one of the few that has off-beat segments that don't bog the game down. They have what could be the equivalent of the DMC1 water sections or Bayonetta bike sections, but they are done very well and tend to use the game's own mechanics.

There's a boat section, hidden shops and areas to find, lots of optional treasure hunting, optional sub bosses, but also rooms that are pure traps, some puzzles, some optional puzzles.

And as added by Ksub, each room is a puzzle that can be knifed basically, so you're constantly testing. I can do a room a billion times and always think of a new strategy, a new way to engage - all with what can be described as 'simple' mechanics. It also has absolute killer pacing. Just as the village is wearing out its welcome, it gets dark, just as that gets screwed, you go to a new area. Just as you tire of a foe, a new one is introduced. And there are too many weapons to carry, so every run you go "hey, let me give this weapon a shot", and some weapons can really turn the tactics of a room up side down. Even underloved weapons like the Punisher can shine.

I cannot attest this more than possible. Screw playing Ninja Gaiden. Screw God Hand. Screw God of War, screw Devil May Cry, Vanquish, anything. Play Resident Evil 4. I don't say this lightly, it really is one of the best games ever made, really one of those 'play this before you die' titles.

A fun addendum: I actually played this game in 2003 or 2004 (I cannot recall) at a electronics convention. There were some other games there too like Metroid Prime 2, VJ (1 or 2), Prince of Persia Warrior Within and Goldeneye Rogue Agent. And Resident Evil 4. The game only had the village section. And I had never played anything like this. It was like playing a game from the future. The way enemies responded to being hit. How they ambushed you, used ladders. I was never safe.

Really left an impression on me.

Agree with everything you guys are saying. RE4 is super replayable thanks to pacing(there’s really no “ugh, I hate this part” sections), a ton of viable and differing weapons, loads of details, secrets, speed running potential, challenge runs, etc.

>sections that use the game’s mechanics

This is one thing that has always stuck out to me about the game: every goddamn thing in the game revolves around being shot. You shoot specific body parts for different reactions, you shoot enemy projectiles and weapons out of their hands, shoot levers to activate things, shoot treasure to make it fall, shoot planks stuck in gears to get everything moving, the list goes on and on. The game absolutely embraced the fact that it was an OTS shooter, it’s always having you take good shots for something.

>screw these games, play RE4

I’ll have to agree to this. All the games you listed are the cream of the crop, but RE4 is almost in its own league. I fanboy hard over all of Mikami’s games(in case that wasn’t obvious), but I wouldn’t recommend any of his post-RE4 titles to  anyone who hasn’t properly dived into RE4.

>never played anything like it

That sounds awesome! I bet that was really memorable. I vividly remember renting the game the day it came out. I was in 7th grade(damn I’m old!) and we had a snow day. The moment I fought those first three enemies outside the first house I knew the game was going to be special. I got to play it before my older brother and I kept telling him it’s different than any game we’ve ever played, and he didn’t believe it until he tried it. It was a crazy time. This was just a few weeks after I had got MGS3 for Christmas and was struggling to pull myself away from a millionth playthrough of that. Even being only 12 years old I remember thinking to myself, “wow I am spoiled, I just got to play two games that I think will be my favorites forever”. Now I’m 27 and I can’t say enough good things about these games, and still play them every year to this day.

Sorry for the long blog post, getting nostalgic here!

>ksub avatar

Nice dude! I see this conversation has got to you, too. Haha.

Dear god that avatar gives me flashbacks. It was my avatar on MSN for years upon years when I was an edgy teenager with more emoji in my name-tag than I'd care to admit. Krauser's cutscene was so cool.

> memories
It's weird how that works doesn't it? Somehow you can notice "this game is freak'n nuts'. I think the grade system over there must be different, since 7th grade would make you 9 years old here. I'd be crying for my mother at that age at the sight of something like RE4!

I still remember RE4 gave me some nightmares initially because it really freak'n scared me. I even considered selling it in turn for Baten Kaitos (which I bought lateron). Glad I didn't cave and went on.

Infinity_Divide wrote:
Nice dude! I see this conversation has got to you, too. Haha.

Thanks! Well, since Roy decided to defect to the land of cute sprites and unskippable text boxes, I thought I might as well join you in flying the flag of the MikamiGang. Gotta send a message.

Can’t say enough good things about this game either, I doubt we'll ever see anything like it ever again to be honest. Including this upcoming train wreck of a remake, although I'd love nothing more than to be proven wrong, of course.

I'd add more brutal insults but other than that you guys have summed it all up.

Expect all costumes and Ada to be DLC.

Speaking of Bluepoint, I'm playing the SOTC remake right now and it's insane how they've changed nothing aside from the graphics. The physics, controls, everything plays EXACTLY like the PS2 version.

I wonder if, after this remake releases, they'll stop releasing the remaster of the original.

Ha! I just want that whenever people play Golden Sun, they think of me everytime they use Felix

> they'll stop remastering the original
Birdman please. Capcom would never refuse the oppertunity to port over Resident Evil 4 twice per generation. Expect both versions to re-release by-yearly, sometimes on the same machine if necesarry.

I wouldn't mind a 'reskin' of the original game, that would be interesting. Highly doubt it though.

Even as someone that wouldn't put RE4 in their favourites list, nor do I have any intention of going really in-depth, since it's just not really my type of thing, I will absolutely advocate for everyone to play RE4 at least once before they die. I will definitively say that it's one of the most polished, and finely designed games I've ever played, and I can totally understand why so many people list it as one of their favourite games, and the influence that it had on many other games. At least just play it for history's sake. At least. I'm also pretty glad about the amounts of pushback that the idea of an RE4make has been getting online, since a lot of people feel the same way.

Of course, I'm not one to talk, since I never played Mario 64, or Ocarina of Time. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Back to the whole remake thing, instead of just being RE4 but better graphics, the ability to move while shooting, and less details in combat, they should just go all out, and do their own thing. At least then, there's some semblance of originality.

I'm curious though, what's everyone's opinion over here on RE5?

TheFirmament1 wrote:
I'm curious though, what's everyone's opinion over here on RE5?

I think RE5 is a decent and occasionally very enjoyable game. But it simply doesn't have the immaculate pacing and thoughtful design of its predecessor. I often get the sense that it was made by people who genuinely wanted to create a worthy successor to RE4 but without fully understanding what made that particular game so special. The fact that the entire game was basically designed and balanced around coop also hurts the singleplayer experience in a very noticeable way.

Bosses range from garbage to utterly forgettable, unfortunately. Locations don't leave much of an impact, you end up rushing through a lot of similar-looking environments without having the time to really explore the map and take in the atmosphere like you can in the RE4 Castle, for example. The game is very bland in that regard. Music is similarly forgettable.

The core gameplay is solid, albeit rather unpolished. Lots of cheap hits and smaller balancing problems. The enemies are a tad too mobile for the core movement system, you can tell they wanted to have more of a GoW-type flow to the combat which unfortunately doesn't mesh very well with the natural limitations of the stationary shooting. Pound-for-pound, I think RE6 has a better combat system than RE5, despite that game's atrocious... well, everything else.

The story takes itself way too seriously for its own good, it's basically the first in the series to put a lot of effort in its cutscenes and voice acting, and it falls completely flat on its face. There is a lot of charm and identity that got lost in translation, like the soulless menu-based shop instead of the iconic Merchant. On the plus side, Wesker is unforgettable and there are a select few memorable lines and moments.

Anyway, I played it for hundreds of hours when it first came out, so it's definitely playable and a much better overall package than RE6. I replayed it last year for the first time in quite a while and was rather disappointed. I doubt I'll ever revisit it, to be honest. It really doesn't belong to the top echelon of endlessly replayable RE games for me.


PS: The Mercs community adores this game, but I could never get past what I perceive to be a myriad a little problems to really get sucked into this one. I appreciate the ludicrously high skill ceiling, but I find high-level play way too monotone and subject to unfair randomization. That's very much a minority opinion on my part, though!



In short, an inferior and forgettable coop-based version of RE4.

Well, I think it'd be rude if I didn't bump it up to be the next game I play from my backlog...

I have the HD version on Steam and would prefer to play M+KB - does this ruin the intended difficulty?

> RE 5

I absolutely loved it when it came out. It was my first RE so I didn't have any nostalgia or survival horror requirements going in and as a coop action horror game I loved it. I wouldn't even entertain playing horror games at the time so it was the right level of "scary" for me. It was unintentionally hilarious in some parts too.

You pretty much nailed my response, word for word. Crazy.

Completely agree with Ksub, and I’ll add that the forced AI partner for the entire game does it absolutely no favors. People complain about Ashley? She’s only with you for ~20% of the game and will get out of your way. Sheva is with you the whole way through, wastes ammo and health like you wouldn’t believe, and gets overwhelmed easily.

There’s a lot of other things I dislike, the more generic inventory system rather than RE4’s case, the mostly simplistic bosses, boring environments, etc. I can’t help but feel they wanted to one-up RE4 but most of Capcom’s good designers were gone so they couldn’t come up with any ideas.

As far as mercs...it’s fun enough, but the scoring that, if I remember correctly, only rewards melees is garbage imo. It not only forces you into constantly fishing for melees, but it turns half of the match into watching the same unskippable animations. When I do play mercs, I don’t do it for score, but for no-hit runs.

I know I’m in the minority but I prefer RE6. The game is goofy, has a shit load of dumb sections, it ruined some of the weapon functions(this is where the shotgun turned into a noodle and lost its knockdown, and enemies don’t really react to weapons differently), but the added mechanics are enjoyable to me, and there’s a ton of enemy variety.

I went back to play both of these games after my recent Vanquish/TEW binge ironically, and neither of them do it for me like they used to. They’re still fine, but can’t touch what came before them.

Gregorinho wrote:
I have the HD version on Steam and would prefer to play M+KB - does this ruin the intended difficulty?

As far as I'm concerned, yes. Same as Vanquish, arguably even more so.

This game is completely designed around the GameCube controller which offers by far the best experience (and button layout). If that's not an option, I would strongly recommend playing it with literally any other controller over mouse and keyboard.

And while you're at it, I would also recommend using the original Control Type that lets you aim with the right trigger and shoot with the face button. Trust me now, thank me later.

Infinity_Divide wrote:
I went back to play both of these games after my recent Vanquish/TEW binge ironically, and neither of them do it for me like they used to. They’re still fine, but can’t touch what came before them.

I still play RE6 Mercs from time to time for the godly combat. RE6 plays unlike anything else, and when it clicks it is immensely enjoyable. But man, there is nothing in the world that could convince me to go anywhere near that complete and utter garbage fire of a campaign ever again!

>Of course, I'm not one to talk, since I never played Mario 64, or Ocarina of Time.

Ah, so I'm not alone on this, haha (at least with the OoT part. Never played MM either).

As for RE4, I agree with everyone saying that, if you haven't played this title, put everything aside and go play RE4. Played it more than 15 times, and this is coming from someone who played that game before being properly interested in the Action genre, so that's saying a lot.

I wonder if there's a way I could use my Smash Bros GC controller adapter with the PC version of RE4...
I'll look in to it. If not I have a 360 or PS4 controller that I could use instead.

I feel like I have committed blasphemy by not playing this so I better get started on it soon!   the point about using the original control type is interesting. Is there a reason it's better to shoot with the face button (other than button = digital and trigger = analogue)?

Gregorinho wrote:I wonder if there's a way I could use my Smash Bros GC controller adapter with the PC version of RE4...
I'll look in to it.

I'm sure there's a workaround for that if you know how to deal with drivers and such. The only issue I can think of would be to re-configure the button layout externally, as the in-game presets are based on the 360 controller. But if it's too much trouble, either 360 or PS4 controller should be perfectly fine.

Gregorinho wrote:the point about using the original control type is interesting. Is there a reason it's better to shoot with the face button (other than button = digital and trigger = analogue)?

Well, I think the original control type leads to the most comfortable hand movement. All four face buttons are put to good use and the knife has its own trigger. Shooting and reloading are right next to one another. The inventory (which you have to use very frequently) sits comfortably on Y and can be quickly accessed on GameCube, as opposed to awkwardly having to hit Start (or even worse, the touchpad on PS4) on the later versions.

The movement system is also based on a digital 8-way input, as opposed to the 360-degree analogue system of modern games. The octagonal gate on the GC controller is per-fect for that.

When they ported it to modern platforms, they tried to emulate standard TPS controls by having you aim with the left trigger and shoot with the right trigger by default. The problem is that it leaves the more responsive digital face button unused for no good reason. You can't aim with the right stick either, so your right thumb just awkwardly waits until you have to reload, which is just dumb.

I've also head from numerous new players that using the original layout helped with bypassing their TPS-muscle memory, so to speak. This game really doesn't play like anything else and it's probably best to have a control type that represents that. For example: the right stick camera controls are digital-only, and you are never meant to leave your thumb on the right stick by default like in so many TPSs. Just leave it alone, it'll follow by itself.


...There is a reason I still have my GameCube set up!

One person on Reddit did add a very scary predicament to the whole scenario, which is scary if you think about it. Though I doubt Capcom will do it, it has happened before: the death of the original.

Some companies have in the past removed the original game from all digital storefronts, or went as far as to patch the original game to be the new one (i.e. Warcraft 3). If this game is a bewildering success, it might lead to the classic RE4 never being re-released again, and removed from Steam/PSN/XBLA as a result. Again, I really doubt that will happy with how greedy Capcom is, but it has happened before.

> OoT
A great game, but I'd also add that it hasn't aged that gracefully. Lots of things about the title are praised where I found them lacking like its story. The game is absolutely monsterous for its time however. Graphics aside it plays like a game from two generations later, and invented so many mechanics we basically have it to thank for every 3d action game since. Also great selection of puzzles, dungeons and races.

> Majora
Too depressing for me honestly haha! Never got through it.

> Mario 64
I love 3d platformers, but this is the one game I never enjoyed, even as a kid when it released. There is an absolutely mindblowing video out there though where Nintendo gives a live demo of the game being played and its existance just shocks the audience. Since that was the first 3d game ever shown.

> RE5
Ksub basically ninja'd me haha. But yeah, it has the heart in the correct place, and might be one of the most fun co-operative games out there. The Singleplayer is really hurt by the inclusino of the co-op though, you can feel that it was quickly inserted as for a big chunk of the game's development it was a singleplayer game. It really is a 'kitchensink' game though, a crap ton of missions, content, enemies, weapons, mercenaries is freak'n expanded to the sky's limits. But it lost a lot of soul along the way. Chris was always a dull protagonist and this really doubled down on it. It also has some conflicts in style, trying to be super serious only to go full B-movie Ham near the end.

Of all the things I missed the most though, were weapon names. M911 has a lot less meaning ot me than Red9 or Blacktail.

> mercs
To note, the game rewards melee kills with +5 secs as a reward. If you kill all enemies within the time, each remaining second adds to your score. But there's a lot more going on though, such as smartly using spawns to make them appear next to the bonus-point items and making quick kills when it is active, memorizing the super-weapon locations in each map. Not to mention the depth co-op adds to it. Still my favourite one, high skill ceiling, a tad random to keep it interesting, but just so freak'n tense. Great music too.

> RE6
Never played it but honestly heard a lot of good things about its mercs mode.

> controller for RE4
Yeah if you can, play it with a controller, a Gamecube one if possible.

> why face buttons
Mostly because the A button was central to the design of the Gamecube, and RE4 was built with that in mind. Of all the buttons, you will press that one the most. It is used in QTEs, used to kick foes, used to inspect items and used to press fire.

I'd almost go as far as to say, buy a cheap Gamecube with this game. Shouldn't be too expensive, depending on where you live. Definitive way to play it imo. A lot of people prefer the Wii version but honestly the ol 'cube is where it's at.

Royta/Raeng wrote:
> mercs
Great music too.

Well if you wanna go there, I'm gonna have to point out that RE5 Mercs only uses the same standard track all the time, whereas RE4 Mercs has a different track for every character, and they're all wonderful!  

Royta/Raeng wrote:
I'd almost go as far as to say, buy a cheap Gamecube with this game. Shouldn't be too expensive, depending on where you live. Definitive way to play it imo. A lot of people prefer the Wii version but honestly the ol 'cube is where it's at.

Yeah, it's not as crazy as it sounds.

Although the Wii version does have native widescreen and original controls since you can just plug in the GameCube controller, so that's far from a bad version. The problem is just that the Wii motion controls more or less break the game and devalue a lot of its more discreet mechanical nuances, such as the various aiming sensitivities across different weapon types.

Not to mention that knifing-QTEs are absolutely borked in it. You can 'mash' so fast you'll OHKO the El Gigante, even on Pro.

> Music
Most of RE4's tracks, especially Mercs, were blatant rips from other games like Onimusha 3 and PN03, so I'm not giving it any props for that haha. RE5 had less tracks (though the DLC and remaster added more), but I felt they were really good.

Note: funny no-one mentions RE5's versus mode. It was paid sadly, but pretty fun imo.

Royta/Raeng wrote:
Most of RE4's tracks, especially Mercs, were blatant rips from other games like Onimusha 3 and PN03, so I'm not giving it any props for that haha.

Some of them yeah, but I think this one at least is an original track, isn't it?



THIS GAME. IT'S SO GOOD.

Oh man that song is so freak'n good. I loved the Chikyo Chagi.. such a cool move.

"I'm not giving it any props for that haha"

Obscurantist!

Being the contrarian you like being I'm half surprised you're not being critical of RE4 here

Jests aside, it still leaves a bad taste for me currently knowing it ripped so many tracks. "Infiltration" was one of the first MP3s I ripped from the web as a teenager, to find out it is from Onimusha was really weird for me.

I wonder why they did that though? I know RE4 was basically rushed out the door, with the current version we got being made in around 15 months or so (maybe even less). You'd think that other things would be more rushed though, but that they could at least re-use OST elements from previous versions of the game.

Also not a fan of some of the other tracks to be honest. Ganado II is the only good main combat track imo (the one that plays during the cabin). Boss tracks range from extremely dull to forgettable. The only one that sticks out for me is Krauser's final track and the final boss theme. Leon and Ada's track is prety dull in Mercs. Krauser's was also a rip iirc, we all know Hunk's is. Infiltration was ripped. "Strange Pasture" and the save theme were really good though, and Wesker's theme of course. Regenerator's theme was okay I'd say. "Back Up" was fitting, if a bit generic. So yeah, soundtrack wise I'm not too big a fan overall. When it's good it's good, but most are forgettable, dull or just insulting for just being rips. Far from the game's strongest element I'd say.

I dunno man, I like the soundtrack a lot. But maybe it's because I played all of those other games after having played RE4, so it doesn't quite have the same effect on me. And even the tracks that don't stand out as much are a net positive to the atmosphere.

I did recognize one of the RE4 castle track when playing the first DMC recently, so I certainly see where you're coming from.

I love Ada's Mercs track. Very smooth and jazzy, fits the character perfectly in my opinion.

While we're on the subject, could you remind me what Krauser's and Hunk's tracks are from? I think I knew Hunk's at some point, but I must have forgotten in the meantime... P.N.03, maybe?

>OoT

I’m personally a bigger fan of Twilight Princess for its combat and dungeons, but this is another game I think everyone should play. Zelda-likes have done some things about better since its release, but it’s still worth playing. I’ll say one thing about this game though: it has an atmosphere that no other game can give you. It goes from cheery and adventurous, almost suffocatingly so, to...well, something quite opposite haha. Amazing soundtrack too.

>Mario 64

I will admit this game is kind of hard for me to play now. Been spoiled by the other 3D games in the series. Still has really impressive level design and a great array of moves, I just don’t think it all fits together as nicely as it does in something like Galaxy.

>mercs

Yeah that’s what I was referring to. To me it just feels like every merc match is watching a shit load of melee attacks because it’s the way to manually increase the timer. Really gets old after a while. I’d prefer if the timer went up based on chain kills or something.

>RE4 music

Wow, didn’t know that many tracks were ripoffs. I’m in the same boat as ksub and heard them in RE4 first so that’s where they’re from in my mind!

>DMC castle track

Maybe I’m going crazy, I never noticed this, and I did play DMC1 first.

Hunk's is from P.N.03, it is used during Stage 8: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1TyOWUCqFI
They did went through the effort of at least removing the first 20 seconds from the track for whatever reason in RE4 (maybe to make it loop easier).

Krauser's was used for Stage 4: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-J89ESS0xNA

Mikami really dislikes P.N.03 so maybe he just wanted those tracks to get a second chance or something.

"Infiltration" was from Onimusha 3, though that could be considered an homage, since that game inspired RE4. They at least remixed the track though. The track is called Demon Forest:
https://youtu.be/U29uVay5GYs

Infinity_Divide wrote:>DMC castle track

Maybe I’m going crazy, I never noticed this, and I did play DMC1 first.

Okay, wanna get nerdy? Let's get nerdy.

I misspoke, it's not a whole track. It's a sound cue. Blink and you'll miss it.

Listen closely to the melody at precisely 1:27, just before the violin kicks in:


They re-used that exact same cue as one of the main elements of RE4's Serenity track, like at the very beginning for example:


I know I'm approaching conspiracy theory territory here, but my ears tell me with absolute certainty: that is NOT a coincidence!


@Roy: Thanks for the clarification! I never really spent too much time with P.N.03 so it's good to know. Glad they re-used the tracks, they're both great.

That part! I knew I recognised it from somewhere. That's Serentiy, tone for tone. Interesting. Though with DMC I honestly cannot blame them, since it was RE4 originally, there's bound to be overlap.

Royta/Raeng wrote:That part! I knew I recognised it from somewhere. That's Serentiy, tone for tone.

A-ha! Vindication, at last. Yay!