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Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion.

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51Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:39 pm

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
Yeah I have been hearing about how good he is and his first clip bam, owned! haha Laughing

Definitely sold. $30 dollars actually. Right into Koei Tecmo's dirty pockets. I hope they use that money well, maybe they can add another character for their next Musou game that can press square a bunch.

I am thinking of sticking to the DS for most of my first playthrough. I actually want to play the game with every weapon all the way through at least once. It sounds like from the article Roy wrote and a bunch of Itagaki interviews I watched(which are incredible BTW that guy is like Kojima but actually cool), that is the way it was designed to be played, probably why there is no mid combo switching.
It reminds me of how I play RE4 or God Hand. I decide what I want to use for a run and stick to it, you really learn everything that way.

52Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Thu Apr 18, 2019 7:02 pm

RedShot


C-Rank
@Royta/Raeng wrote:Hahahahahah!

Drink the cool-aid. Join the group.

Jokes aside, watch the video I linked above that shows most of the bare basics on how the combat works (basics tutorial). And you can repress block when your guard is broken to 'remake' it. Very handy against longer strings. But honestly, just watch the Basics video and play the game. The challenge starts at Mentor Difficulty. So you first have to beat Warrior which is pretty easy.

Example of me playing the game yesterday: https://xboxclips.com/Raeng15/34afaf62-9d61-4097-8b3e-bfd612ac7728

Wow, if only Microsoft would take backwards compatibility on PC...

53Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Thu Apr 18, 2019 11:54 pm

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
Quick questions:
Does the A+X flip have I-Frames or just the throw?

Do any DS moves have I-Frames I should know about? That is the weapon I am probably sticking to first run.

What is the safest way to do an OT, and can you do an OT mid combo, or do you have to be neutral+Y?

What is the fastest way to do a UT if I am safe and on the ground? Should I jump first, or just start charging?

Is the throw always OP? It seems super OP right now.

54Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Fri Apr 19, 2019 12:07 am

KSubzero1000


D-Rank
@hedfone wrote:
Does the A+X flip have I-Frames or just the throw?

I don't think Wind Run itself has any i-frames, although I could be wrong. The white visual effect is there to differentiate it from the regular jump.


@hedfone wrote:
Do any DS moves have I-Frames I should know about? That is the weapon I am probably sticking to first run.

Izuna Drop (XYXXXY) has insanely generous i-frames at the end, is usually an instant kill and does splash damage. Honestly, it's the most important and reliable bread-and-butter move in the entire game. Learn it.


@hedfone wrote:
What is the safest way to do an OT, and can you do an OT mid combo, or do you have to be neutral+Y?

You can't OT mid-combo or mid-air that I know of. Stick doesn't have to be neutral, however. Just press Y when on the ground near an injured enemy.


@hedfone wrote:
What is the fastest way to do a UT if I am safe and on the ground? Should I jump first, or just start charging?

Jumping and then holding Y as soon as you land is the fastest way to charge a UT, especially if you have essence to absorb.


@hedfone wrote:
Is the throw always OP? It seems super OP right now.

It's indeed very powerful against humanoid enemies. It won't work on the larger fiends, so its utility is severely reduced during the later missions.

55Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Fri Apr 19, 2019 12:15 am

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
Luckily I watched my boy CamboCombo's NG playthroughs years ago. I know all about the power of Zunies. That being said, I am trying not to rely on it. I don't want it to be a HSK cancel situation from God Hand where I become reliant, and I assume Izuna isn't on every weapon? It definitely seems like the only actual button combo worth a damn when there is a huge group.

56Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Fri Apr 19, 2019 12:27 am

KSubzero1000


D-Rank
@hedfone wrote:I assume Izuna isn't on every weapon?

No, although other weapons do have their unique throws that are worth learning as well. Throws are indicated by a special symbol in the move list and always have generous i-frames, as far as I know. But Izuna is definitely the most straightforward and intuitive of them all.

NGS2 has budget Izuna substitutes on every weapon and I think that's dumb.

57Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Fri Apr 19, 2019 1:04 am

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
I think I am taking a firm, I never want to play the sigma games, stance. It seems like the co-op is the only thing worth it. Everything else strayed too far from God's light.

58Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Fri Apr 19, 2019 10:38 am

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
Shush! I didn't have time (or the knowledge) to edit that death out hahahaha!

The Sigma games are nice alternative takes. I really enjoyed Sigma 2 and its bonkers co-op mode for instance. About the Izuna, be careful. On Master Ninja enemies will punish it on landing which can lead to painful situations. I never use the move anymore to be honest.

http://stinger.actieforum.com

59Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sat Apr 20, 2019 2:12 am

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
A few random notes after playing for a bit:
The difference between normal and easy is crazy on the first level, played through on both to test. So many more mages throughout, two archers an the ledge also makes that part much more challenging.
Wish more games changed the enemies up this much between each difficulty.
(looking st you DMCV)

Speaking of DMCV, that games normal might as well be Dynasty Warriors, there is 0 difficulty. The first couple of fights in Ninja Gaiden 2 are harder than anything in DMCV's Normal mode. It is sad that we are here. DMC3 kicked my ass back in the day, and I was playing Special Edition.

I love how much the environment plays a part in the combat. This is a true 3D brawler. Something like DMC never really utilizes the environment. That's why bloody palace is just an empty void. The amount of techniques that require you to bounce off walls, throw people at walls, etc. Juggling all of that in your mind while also having to constantly evade, time UT's, do normal combos... so good. And these aren't brain dead DMCV puppets, these guys want to kill you. They never let up, and this is just NORMAL. They just don't make them like this anymore.

60Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:15 am

Birdman


Moderator
Something like DMC never really utilizes the environment.
I used to love wallrun in DMC3.

They just don't make them like this anymore.
Ain't that the damn truth. I'm gonna start saving for an X1 just for this game. Might even sell DMCV.

61Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:53 am

KSubzero1000


D-Rank
@hedfone wrote:
I love how much the environment plays a part in the combat. This is a true 3D brawler. Something like DMC never really utilizes the environment. That's why bloody palace is just an empty void. The amount of techniques that require you to bounce off walls, throw people at walls, etc. Juggling all of that in your mind while also having to constantly evade, time UT's, do normal combos... so good. And these aren't brain dead DMCV puppets, these guys want to kill you. They never let up, and this is just NORMAL. They just don't make them like this anymore.

Yeah, I love the ways in which Ninja Gaiden utilizes the environment, especially with all the wall techniques.

I don't know that I would single out DMC5 as an example of a game that doesn't do this, however. Most other games in the genre don't. Neither Bayonetta, God Hand, classic GoW or TW101 incorporate this kind of environmental mechanics. Some of the pre-release MGR trailers showcased a wall running mechanic similar to NG, but that ended up being completely removed in the final version as well, unfortunately.

62Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sat Apr 20, 2019 10:46 am

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
DMC5 is just the new "hotness", it's an easy punching bag or me. If you haven't seen the new Gaming Brit DMCV video, it is an hour long DMC wankery. There is almost 0 criticisms towards the game from what I saw.
I skimmed though, don't have an hour for that.

Classic GOW had throwing people off ledges, slamming them into walls. God Hand and the good Yakuza games also have a really good wall bounce mechanics that can lead to cool combos or infinites in God Hand's case. You can also kick people off ledges in that with proper positioning, great way to kill demons but you lose items they drop.
Definitely had some stuff, but not nearly as much as NG.
I'm no COMBOMAD god, but I am pretty sure DMCV has 0 environmental moves? I could be wrong though I guess.

DMC2's wall-running was one of the only cool things it introduced.

63Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sat Apr 20, 2019 10:55 am

KSubzero1000


D-Rank
Yeah, you're right. I forgot about the wall-slamming and ledges in GoW. 3 even had rudimentary wall-running with the Boots of Hermes. My bad.

But NG is very much in a league of its own in that regard. Always regretted the fact that Platinum never really did anything of that nature, as far as I can tell.

64Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sat Apr 20, 2019 11:18 am

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
Or TeamNinja. Like did every creative mind leave with Itagaki? Nioh is OK. But it really is just impressive for how much they put into a souls game, you would think From would have learned something.
But compared to the Itagaki era stuff, it is lacking so much.
I really want to play Devil's Third. I was going to try it on the emulator CEMU, but just never got around to it. I think it was running bad at the time, Bayo 2 was almost unplayable for me when I tried.

Roy, your NG retrospective video was amazing. Very well done. I put it on in the background while playing 2. I didn't even know about the parry move they removed from the hurricane packs. I read somewhere you have to be online to use them? Can you even play those anymore, it's all just super crazy. Imagine if the final chapters of a classic book were all destroyed or something, just nuts that it isn't a PRIORITY for TeamNinja to get that shit remastered. It reminds me of that Christ painting that dumbass cleaning lady ruined forever. Thank god we live in an age of HQ pictures, so it isn't fully lost forever, but still.
I was having a talk with my GF and ultimately games are still a very early medium. Especially full 3d. We have had modern movies as we know them since at least the 50's. We are looking at less than 30 years for modern 3D games. I think Wolf 3D was the first 3D game as we know them now.

Also, does Black let you put guard on RT like 2? That is how I have been playing as it feels more natural to me, but if you can't I will switch to LT ASAP.

65Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sat Apr 20, 2019 7:45 pm

KSubzero1000


D-Rank
@hedfone wrote:
Also, does Black let you put guard on RT like 2? That is how I have been playing as it feels more natural to me, but if you can't I will switch to LT ASAP.

Yes, this is how I play as well.

Black even goes one step further than 2 and lets you fully customize the entire button layout.

66Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:57 pm

Infinity_Divide


C-Rank
Chapter 11 is so badass, man I missed this game. I’m hoping to actually get through MN this time.

>environmental stuff
I really value this kind of stuff, but most of my favorite action games don’t even have jumping, ironically. Even though DMC5 really doesn’t have any of this kind of stuff I think the game has enough going for it in other aspects that it’s not a deal breaker or anything.

>TGB DMC5 review
I stopped watching all gaming channels on YouTube because they’re usually all very biased and some reviews, even though they’re an hour or longer, usually barely explain anything. Some of these channels have followings that take everything they say as fact and don’t question them at all.

67Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 9:15 am

Birdman


Moderator
Every single one that mentions Knack 2 trashes it for no reason. They barely say why. Some reference to the first game and Knack being lame. I usually post a comment and link to my guide here. They'll never view it though.

68Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 9:54 am

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
That is with a lot of games. For me I have noticed, Lolipopchainsaw, Dark Sector, Too Human, Mercenaries 2.
Those are games I personally love a ton for various reasons, but you will get ripped to shreds if you mention liking them. I love Bic Benidects gameplay, but I mentioned Army of Two: The 40th Day, and that I think it is one of the best TPS games ever made, especially coop.
He then put me on blast on twitter saying it was a good laugh, without ever actually discussing it with me.
I lost all respect for him after that, but it seems like he is having a hard time with mental health, so I didn't take it personally. I wish people didn't immediately get shitty when you challenge their preconceived notions, but what are you gonna do. That's just the world we live in.

69Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:06 pm

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
I sit outside for two days and this topic takes off haha!

First some X1X notes, and it isn't good. The Controller really has lag. About 1/10 directional inputs is lost with the controller, I tested the X1's regular controller while Iconoclast used the Elite - both the same issue. I'm looking into setting up the x360 controller to see if it makes a difference. But to have this much problems with directional inputs in this style of game...dangerous. You cannot double tap either, because that's dangerous too (might get running-inputs). It isn't a dealbreaker compared to the horrible lag of before, but just a shame.

On to the discussions at hand!

The difficulty difference stays throughout, Mentor and Master Ninja have totally different enemy layouts which really change up the game. The enviroment playing a part is fantastic too, some weapons - like the Talons - really play into this as well. Its XX>Y I think it is can transition into wall-attacks, such a great weapon. And yeah DMCV has zero enviromental moves outside of summoning Nightmare, which is more visual than anything else.

About the Gamingbrit video, I haven't checked it. He's honestly fun if he just does short dumb skits about how videogames are weird and funny. But ever since he hooked up with TurboButton and GameMaker's Toolkit...he put himself into this game-analyist function and it just doesn't work I feel. His Road to Rocketlauncher series legit made me cringe. Sad to hear that this video is just as bad. Really miss his old-style content.

About Itagaki and Devil's Third. I lay it out a bit in the NG2 article on the site, but a BIG part of the studio and even of Tecmo left when Itagaki and crew were shown the door. I think it was at least 30 people, including art-directors and such. Most temporarily joined him for Devil's Third. The final title was okay, but still very strong if you could look past its shortcomings (mostly due to development hell). I had a lot of fun with it, and it inspired the site we're now on (I got really tired of the reviews).

About the Hurricane Packs, Itagaki saw Black as that game. But he really underestimated just how important the Intercept was. I've got an article lined up on how to get them working on your Xbox, but it's quite the hassle. But you CAN arrange it. Really glad you liked the video man, really! I'm planning on changing some other finalized articles into videos like that down the line.

About Bick, he's been a topic of discussion before. The guy, frankly, lost his mind recently and it is really sad to see. He used to be a great guy but yeah. He needs help, serious help.

Note that I see a lot of talk about (famous) people not seeing the full scope, seeing their opinion as fact and their followers following suit. Please, if I ever seem that way, hit me. I made this site exactly because of those reasons (people having tunnelvision etc.), so I'd hate to see it happen to this platform too.

That said: fuck I love Ninja Gaiden II.


http://stinger.actieforum.com

70Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 1:03 pm

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
It's sad. Bick really is knowledgeable and good at the stuff he plays. I can understand him being upset about 0 views for the effort he puts in. Seraphim17 is like the only guy that got moderately successful posting quality action game commentary/challenge run etc. I wish more people cared about those sort of videos these days.
But yeah his twitter is like scary, school shooter levels of scary. I think he is young, so hopefully it is just a phase. I definitely went through a "I don't care if I live or die fuck the world" phase, but there wasn't internet like that to voice it then.

That sucks about the dropped inputs. Has it been tested on a regular one and the S, and have you tried the performance mode? I wonder if it is the controller or the emulation, I fear the latter. There is a lot to test though, I really hope that gets fixed, but you know Tecmo won't do shit.

71Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 1:18 pm

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
It's a dying breed. Before Youtube was a moneymaker a lot of people just did challenge runs and shared the progress which was fantastic to watch. Bick was the first to really do it in a professional way with editing, post-voice overs, good thumbnails, playlists and the like.

Seraphim is great, but he really has to fill that niche. He tends to do challenge runs on his first run immediately to quickly get on that money-train, because he has to. In a market that goes so fast you cannot wait one month to learn a game, by that time the interest has already passed. See also BullseyeStrider getting like 31 views on probably the best runthrough of Shinobi ever.

About the performance: I'm on performance mode yes.

http://stinger.actieforum.com

72Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:52 pm

Infinity_Divide


C-Rank
I’m one of those 31 people that watched BullseyeStrider’s Shinobi playthrough! Really underrated channel. Seraphim is cool, he’s like the only channel I could find that played ZoE2 on Extreme, and he likes a lot of the same random non-action games that I like.

I don’t mean to turn this into a YouTube discussion but I tuned in for a bit of Matthewmatosis’ stream last night and I just can’t watch the guy anymore. It’s sad because I used to love his videos.

It would be cool to make some videos at some point, I wanted to do tutorials and challenge runs to get some under-appreciated games more exposure. I’m going to get a new PC when I get back from vacation so maybe it’ll happen.

73Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:56 pm

KSubzero1000


D-Rank
@Infinity_Divide wrote:
I tuned in for a bit of Matthewmatosis’ stream last night and I just can’t watch the guy anymore. It’s sad because I used to love his videos.

May I ask why? I still love the guy and he remains by far my favorite YouTube video game critic.

PS: I also like TGB for his passion and enthusiasm despite not really considering him a "critic" per se, so perhaps my tolerance of YT personalities is higher than others'. I found his recent DMC5 video to be heartwarming.

74Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:33 pm

Infinity_Divide


C-Rank
>Matthew
A few reasons. He tries to be super serious analysis guy, yet he’s so laughably biased towards anything Kamiya touches. He also is very big on “experiential” elements of games, yet also tries to be the guy to criticize action games for not being complex enough. He says W101 ruined other action games for him, but as far as I can tell from what he’s said in his streams, he’s never played NG or Vanquish, and only recently beat God Hand and RE4. During his E3 2018 stream he said meh towards RE2, DMC5, and Doom Eternal, yet was excited for Last of Us 2, a sequel to one of the most casual games ever. I’m sorry, I just don’t think he’s as smart as he thinks he is. Also on his stream last night he said that the orange text makes him not want to respond to people. Really? People are spending their time watching you play some niche platformer and you tell them you don’t want to answer their questions?

As for TGB, he’s tried to be more serious in his videos recently and they’re just way more boring. His review of DMC5 didn’t really go too in depth about the mechanics, which is ironic because in the middle of it he makes a remark about being the channel for DMC videos.

75Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:57 pm

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
Going off-topic seems to be a trend here haha, but honestly I'm just glad to see the activity!

In terms of Youtubers there's not a lot that I watch anymore. I still rewatch Excellent Adventures of Gootecks and Mike Ross - but that's mostly just entertainment. In terms of insightful stuff ... generally just high quality challenge runs without voice-overs.

Matthew, like a lot, was great. He had some seriously good analysis that were really fun and insightful - almost like a thesis. I also like how he picks a theme while covering both gameplay and story. He really looks at the total product which is fantastic. My favorite video of his has to be the Dark Souls 1 and Devil May Cry 1 'review' which were nearly 6 hours long each. But I agree that he's extremely biased towards Kamiya and at times also very un-educated in terms of the hobby he's practicing and talking about. Never touched Vanquish. Never played Ninja Gaiden (seriously what is up with big action-youtubers not touching this?) etc. But generally when he puts out a video I watch it.

The downside is that a lot of these people will eventually dry out since they'll go toxic towards their community or their content falters in quality. I was always learned "reputation comes by foot, and leaves by horse". It's why I'm always extremely careful with what I write and take feedback to heart, since I know one wrong sentence in one article can set the site on fire.

About TGB, again, liked his older stuff and how passionate he gets at times. His NGB review made me want to toss the computer out the window, but the NG2 piece made a lot of good. Just wish he'd play to his strengths. When he posts a 5 minute video on some game I've barely even heard of I am giddy, but when I see a 30 minute video about a popular topic or title I tend to skip it. When he's just a guy who loves the games, I love that.

GameMakersToolkit is another big one, but we've had a personal beef. He once didn't care for a comment I made on his Twitter, told his viewers to torch me for fun, only to see it spiral out of control (they sent my fiance death-threats over facebook) and he be very 'protective' of it all and how it wasn't his fault. The next day his promoted God of War wank-fest video went live and I unsubscribed. Sad to see, as some of his videos are pretty good (later-ones fall into typical pitfalls imo).

Now I'm going to be a bit open and ask a question: where do you guys feel Stinger stands? I know its text-based so it is a bit different. I sometimes feel it can be a bit of a Ninja Gaiden wank-fest, but I try to keep it informative and open-minded. Is that succeeding? Or are there faults? Let me know!

http://stinger.actieforum.com

76Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:54 pm

KSubzero1000


D-Rank
@Infinity_Divide wrote:>Matthew
A few reasons. He tries to be super serious analysis guy, yet he’s so laughably biased towards anything Kamiya touches. He also is very big on “experiential” elements of games, yet also tries to be the guy to criticize action games for not being complex enough. He says W101 ruined other action games for him, but as far as I can tell from what he’s said in his streams, he’s never played NG or Vanquish, and only recently beat God Hand and RE4. During his E3 2018 stream he said meh towards RE2, DMC5, and Doom Eternal, yet was excited for Last of Us 2, a sequel to one of the most casual games ever. I’m sorry, I just don’t think he’s as smart as he thinks he is. Also on his stream last night he said that the orange text makes him not want to respond to people. Really? People are spending their time watching you play some niche platformer and you tell them you don’t want to answer their questions?

Thanks for the clarification, although I don't think we're destined to agree on this one!

I personally don't expect critics to be somehow unbiased or perfectly objective at all times, if such a thing is even possible (and I would argue that it isn't). Everybody has their own tastes and preferences, after all. I don't consider his Kamiya favoritism to be an issue as long as he's able to provide solid arguments for his positions and comparisons. It's perfectly possible to be both analytical and opinionated at the same time, and I would argue that he walks that line better than most. Kamiya isn't my favorite action director by any means, but I completely understand where he's coming from when he explains why he thinks so highly of DMC1 or which elements of the GoW reboot disappointed him. That's what he's supposed to do. A good critique isn't meant to establish itself as some sort of unshakable truth, but rather to give the audience something to think about.

As far as NG is concerned, then yes, I would love to hear him play and express an opinion on the games at some point, but my understanding is that he's never owned an Xbox console and didn't want to settle for the Sigma games due to the fan backlash. Not exactly an unreasonable position to take. There are plenty of games worth playing and I can't very much fault someone for not buying a console just to play two games.

I'm pretty sure he has owned and played RE4 numerous times since its initial release, although I could be wrong.

About TLoU2, he's been very vocal in his criticism of a lot of the scripted and shallow mechanical elements of the first one. But the game also has other elements worth talking about, and it makes sense to be curious about the direction the story might go in the sequel, for example. Video games aren't limited to their mechanics and even those aimed at a broader audience shouldn't automatically be excluded from the conversation. I don't see that as evidence of him being "not smart".

I get the impression you guys are criticizing him for not being the ideal "big action-youtuber", but I don't think he's ever positioned himself as such. His channel started off with covering Zelda and MGS games, and he spends a lot of time talking rather extensively about various puzzle games, for example. The fact that he happens to be particularly fond of Kamiya-style action games doesn't mean that he's failing as a critic for not covering Vanquish. I'd rather listen to people talk about things they genuinely care about rather than waste precious time ticking off arbitrary credibility boxes. A broad frame of reference is obviously a plus, but not necessarily a pre-requisite. If Roy decides to write a passionate article on F-Zero GX tomorrow, then I don't think it'd be very fair to dismiss his observations based on the absence of Gran Turismo or Burnout articles on the site, for example. And if anything, I wish more YouTubers took the same Quality over Quantity approach.


PS: Sorry for the derail, I'm obviously not trying to pick a fight with anybody here. Just a bit taken aback by the point-blank negativity. Not really used to the GameFAQs / Reddit conversational style.

PPS: Very sorry to hear about the beef with Mark Brown, man. Twitter brings out the worst in people.

77Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:53 pm

RedShot


C-Rank
The environment stuff in NG is very interesting from the viewpoint of an observer like me. I unfortunately can't play it at the moment because I have no Xbox console. I've recently played Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time and there are some basic attacks that use the environment. I have heard that Warrior Within does a lot more things with the combat and expand this idea.

About Stinger Magazine, I really like the site. I've probably read all of the articles and they're always interesting and well-thought. NG deserves more exposure so I think it's fine to talk about why it's so important for the genre.

78Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:39 pm

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
As I stated in another topic, please, don't fear for unpopularity of your opinion here. To me they all matter as long as it isn't offensive and respectful to others! We can like different things or people, just keep it civil (as it is going right now) and all is fine!

KSub

I admit I / the forum can be a bit harsh or negative at times, mostly due to bitterness carried over from other forums or whatnot. Bias is hard to deal with as a critic. I don't consider myself a professional one, just a hobbiest, but it can be hard to ignore your taste and look at the bigger picture of "why is it like this". Matthew does this well though I feel most of the time. I used to watch another reviewer, AtrophyofSouls, and he tended to hide his bias with use of fancy words.

In the end though, you look for people that echo your opinion most of the time. Not matter how well constructed my eventual critism of Sekiro will be, I won't sway those that love it. I witnessed this firsthand with my God of War article. My editor actually played the title too and loved it, but he admitted he could understand my reasonings and facts, just that he 'still liked it'. Taste can be a funny thing.

My favorite film ever is Event Horizon. And I still don't know why. If I look at the facts the film is a disaster, yet it facinates me. Same with Road Trip, a horribly bad American comedy with childish sex jokes. But I must have watched that film a dozen times by now.

About the big-action youtuber bit, not too sure about that. Personally just saw him as a internet critic. That's more GamingBrit, he really tries to focus on that action-genre.

One thing I will say though, is if I were to write a passionate F-Zero GX expose (and on the mark, as I love that game!), I would hold myself accountable for not playing other big racers. Reviewing them is another matter, but I do feel that if you want to make a critique (and thus, not a blog, vlog or just a forum post), you need to have breathed it all to some extent. You don't review Spec Ops The Line without having read Heart of Darkness or watching Apocalypse Now - they are too interlinked. For example for my article on the recent Fist of the North Star title I watched a good portion of the anime, read parts of the manga, talked to an anime-history buff about the series influences etc - and in the end I maybe used one line of that total knowledge. But I still feel that on some level it helps make a better article/ critique / review / whatever you want to call it.

You are absolutely right about talking from passion though! I honestly don't care too much if they are passionate. Which is why I honestly don't care for TGBS right now; because he ... kind of feels like he's lacking that passion and just doing it as his job now (it is his job now right?).

About the Twitter incident, it happens haha! Should've seen my face when I opened my twitter after a night's rest to 99+ messages in my inbox. I just joked to many people about it and they weren't laughing, enfin, thankfully Twitter's hatemob just stays on a single target for like 10 minutes before moving on to the next thing they dislike!

But again, please don't feel unwelcome or w/e because of some comments. We're all talking in good spirits.

RedShot

Funnily enough the remade PoP series and Ninja Gaiden always had a connection in enviromental combat, but it always seemed coincidental. In my draft of an interview with Itagaki, it was a question of mine if either was inspired by the other somewhat. Always be prepared haha! Warrior Within is fantastic by-the-by, highly recommend it!

http://stinger.actieforum.com

79Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Mon Apr 22, 2019 12:58 am

Birdman


Moderator
I can understand him being upset about 0 views for the effort he puts in
I remember Saur had similar feelings. Not about gaining views, but just how you work hard to put out quality content and it just gets shut down by trolls and these know nothing journalists.

He once didn't care for a comment I made on his Twitter, told his viewers to torch me for fun,
That's because he's full of shit and while he sounds reasonable in his vids he states his opinions as fact and turns nasty when opposed and proven wrong. Most of these youtubers are like cult leaders and their followers are nuts. Did he know or have anything to say about those death threats? You should expose his sorry ass.

I sometimes feel it can be a bit of a Ninja Gaiden wank-fest, but I try to keep it informative and open-minded.
Yeah but you don't claim it's the best ever or make shit up.

I'm obviously not trying to pick a fight with anybody here. Just a bit taken aback by the point-blank negativity.
Years of arguing on Gamefaqs and others has made us bitter old men. Being attacked for discussing mechanics and proving people wrong with facts because they have some weird troll agenda that a game of their choosing MUST remain bad at all costs. Look at my somewhat recent adventures on the DMCV board regarding Chaos Legion, how butthurt people get when you tell them something they don't know, because in their own minds they had established that they knew it all.

Here's a fantastic example on Knack 2 I came across recently. Go to 5:18.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkElGsk-5ZA

>Claims it's better than Knack 1, but that's like comparing shit with shit.
Why? No real reasons. No mechanical knowledge presented.

>Claims we know are not the best platformers in the world.
>We know
If only you did.
Speaking for the second game, a lot of the platforming is pretty interesting requiring you to change size a lot.

>Dont want to play into the meme
Then plays into it. Says it's the perfect time to make fun of it.

>Asks why would they make a sequel after the first horrible game?
Why make DMC3 after DMC2?

>Wanted to prove they could make a better version
The fuck else would you try a sequel for???

>Made it a little better
Yet can't explain how or why it's only a little better (refer to tactical forum, and see this thing called evidence and mechanical knowledge).

>No one interested 'for a reason'. Cites boring characters, everything about it being lame.
Subjective/no knowledge of mechanics.

This is the kind of attitude I'm talking about and have lost count of these morons who post their lack of knowledge as fact.

80Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Mon Apr 22, 2019 8:12 am

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
I do feel it is important to note that while a lot here come from toxic forums seeking escape, that is also what we should do: escape. I get that it can be fun to talk smack from this safe place about people making dumb comments and go "oh look at those fools" but lets not make it the main-stay of the forum.

http://stinger.actieforum.com

81Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Mon Apr 22, 2019 10:14 am

Birdman


Moderator
Sorry, you're right.



82Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Mon Apr 22, 2019 10:56 am

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
At this point we should just start a "gaming journo discussion" thread or something, though I have enjoyed reading everyone's take on the subject.

Back to the topic at hand, some questions:

I am struggling with charging UT's. Is there a max distance for the essence to absorb?
I swear it is floating around but I get the normal slow charge. I remember killing a guy, immediately charging and seeing the essence just sit there beside me. It's hard to tell for sure what is happening and learn from things because this game moves so damn fast. It is like the opposite of Dark Souls.

I noticed there is armor on the UT charge, what all, if anything, can break you out of it. I have only seen grabs stop my charge.

I am having a lot of trouble with OT's as well. I will run up to a limbless Ninja and just get an uppercut, he gets juggled, and I get hit by some BS because I was expecting Iframes from the OT.

I know a lot of this will just come with time, learning the nuisances of the controls.
God Hand feels so foreign when you first get into it, but by the end it is second nature.
I am just having trouble processing failures because of the speed of it all.

83Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:03 pm

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
I think that would merrit a seperate topic, not a bad idea! And no worries Birdman!

About the UT system:

If you do the UT-charge standing still you'll need a few frames for it to activate and see the essence fly to you. There is a range-limit to the essence drag but it is still insanely huge, just a bit more restrictive than in Black (where you could chain essence from the whole stage away).

The way to get the 'instant' charge is an OLUT - On Landing Ultimate Technique. Press and hold Heavy just as you land and you'll get an instant charge. Note that the ability has armour on start-up, but no i.frames. You don't get those until you're in the animation. The charge itself has minor armour, but larger hits like Incendiary Shurikens immediately negate the charge.

About OTs, it can be finnicky. If Ryu is just slightly out of range doing a directional input will screw it up, so it's best to just do a raw Y input instead of for instance >Y.

It does take some getting used to. I have...I think 500~hours played across its versions and consoles, so it is second nature for me.

About the Xbox version:

I've done more testing. 10% of my directional inputs drops. It is really a hard 10%, 1 in 10. This is pretty scary as I've had uppercuts become regular strikes, >X's become regular X's (which lack i.frames) and at worst seen a dodge not register. I have no clue as to what triggers this and how to fix it.

http://stinger.actieforum.com

84Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Tue Apr 23, 2019 10:27 am

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
The game is starting to click and feels great. I am actually trying to style on guys even though Zunies would be easier. I love how the game mocks you with dead ninja scrolls about techniques it knows first time ninjas will struggle with too. It is like it wants you to seek other stronger ninjas(forums like this) to get them down. Roy your last post about essence made perfect sense, I am doing some crazy shit now.

One question: The LT+X parry seems SUPER powerful, it makes getting out of jams easy. Get a lucky delimb with it and it is UT chain city. Do all weapons have it, and if I rely on it in this, will I be in trouble in Black?
I don't think it has a parry quite like this without Hurricane Packs.

I love that you can OT a headless enemy if you are fast enough, I assume that boosts score.

85Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Tue Apr 23, 2019 11:33 am

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
Awesome to hear Hed! Styling can be so much fun. What I also really like is how the game allows you to change a bad situation into a good one. For instance you're doing a juggle in the air, but get hit out of the air by a shuriken but use that to do an On Landing UT. Fantastic!

About the parry. You also have an Y one that leads into a juggle into Izuna if you wish, very good. Every weapon has a parry and they are excellent when under pressure. Note that you can also use them on bosses to great effect! Genshin is especially weak to them. You can even parry projectiles (most of them anyway). I feel the Flails and Kusari-gama have the best counter personally. The Flails X counter has the highest delimb% in the game I feel, while the Kusari's Y counter just has massive range and i.frames.

The parry here is 'weaker' than Black's though, where it doesn't have a failed-animation if you mistime it. You can quite literally hold block in that game and parry away at some foes that don't have grabs. Example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yr9_bW2g7l8

The stabs he's doing with the lunar, that's a parry. It is really good. Fully i.framed too.

http://stinger.actieforum.com

86Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Tue Apr 23, 2019 11:46 am

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
What is the difference between that and the Intercept from Hurricane?

87Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Tue Apr 23, 2019 12:34 pm

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
Intercept is more like Royal Guard and gives you a full UT charge as I recall. The regular parry is just a unique i.framed move.

http://stinger.actieforum.com

88Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Tue Apr 23, 2019 4:59 pm

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
Watched some Sigma 2 gameplay for the hell of it. Dude. I thought the changes were mostly gameplay but they effed up so much IMO. The second stage used to be an incredible and terrifying assault on your home base that is swarming with spider clan and burning to cinder. In Sigma it looks like a pretty mario level. Stage 3 used to be a brutal ambush from these massive fiends that took over NY that were completely different to fight, and a nice change of pace. In Sigma, just more spider clan.
Definitely not my cup of tea.

Also Roy, I know you like Sigma 2 as it was your first, and I respect that. I like twin snakes more than PSX Metal gear.
Just wanted to say your article didn't come off as biased at all towards any NG and really paid proper respect to the OG titles. Your unbiased writing is incredible. I wish all games journalists had your abilities and mindset, unfortunately it seems none do.
Do you have any formal education in writing, or is it all self taught?

Edit: Did the first test of valor. Used one herb which was my first real item I have used so far. Super fun but took a lot out of me, my brain was wiped after that. I probably won't do them all first playthrough, I could see them getting tedious if later ones have a lot of ranged spammers.
Also the forced ranged combat sections just suck in this. The only real blemish next to the wonky camera moments.

89Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Wed Apr 24, 2019 8:36 am

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
I'll be the first to say I'll probably never play NGS2 again outside of the co-op. The game indeed ruined a lot of great moments, the chapter 11 change being the most nuts (I won't spoil it yet since I don't think you're there yet). But I can't help but respect the effort they put in. As I note in the article, the game has massive shortcomings but it is honestly just a totally different game and experience. It is why when I hear people don't like NGII, I urge them to try NGS2 and vice versa.

And I respect that man, though other forums would see you killed for liking Twin Snakes more, I respect it. Each their own (I like Twin Snakes more too).

The Tests of Valor are pretty fun, but can get bonkers. They are harder on Master Ninja to the point that you cannot beat them without extreme cheese, item spam or UT abuse. I don't think anyone's beaten the first one yet without UTs and Ninpo and cheese on Master Ninja. It really is just bonkers nuts. About the ranged fights; use the enviroment. Prioritze the archers and use walls, line of sight, kunai and versatile weapons like the tonfa to get close. The Scythe's Flying Swallow is great too since it has i.frames.

If you want to laugh: https://xboxclips.com/Raeng15/600a4ccb-b879-4c72-b213-a46918df3352 (around 1:05). Projectile insanity.

About the writing, first off thanks for the kind words. Really. I do this pure out of passion and fun, so it is good to hear people like it! :) About the writing, it's a bit of all things.

When I made explainer animations I did so with a writer as partner, we made nearly 300 of those per year together so I really learned a lot from him about getting the essence of a story and what's important, what's not, how to communicate via words etc. I also have an editor (https://stinger-magazine.com/about/) that I pay to check each article for me. He's a game-designer himself but also a thesis-checker for universities. So he really looks at the grammer, but also the core message. Sometimes he'll really give insights into what works and doesn't; a writer is only as good as his editor I always say! Rest is just self taught and based on experiences.

http://stinger.actieforum.com

90Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Wed Apr 24, 2019 8:39 am

Birdman


Moderator
What is the reason for NOT like The Twin Snakes? I can't see anything wrong with it.

91Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Wed Apr 24, 2019 8:44 am

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
Can't speak for them, but the game has different voice-actors, lots more matrix-like slow-mo scenes, has different controls (MGS2 style) and some other changes.

https://www.reddit.com/r/metalgearsolid/comments/6ixc2x/is_it_exaggerated_how_bad_metal_gear_twin_snakes/

http://stinger.actieforum.com

92Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Wed Apr 24, 2019 9:00 am

Birdman


Moderator
The only thing I can agree with is the accents. The gameplay is way better. The cut-scenes were cool too. If those over the top scenes were in the original, no one would say a thing.

93Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Wed Apr 24, 2019 11:43 am

RedShot


C-Rank
The Twin Snakes uses MGS2 controls that are way better but at the same time they break MGS1's structure. Even boss fights are ruined, Ocelot becomes a joke for example. So at first it's better to play than the original but it is not built around those improvements. About NG2, is the One version better than the 360 one even with dropped inputs or gameplay-wise the 360 version is the way to go?

94Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Wed Apr 24, 2019 11:53 am

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
Oh the Xbox One X version is the way to go for sure, the dropped inputs are an issue but are nothing compared to the low-framerate the game used to have. Also crashes less (never so far).

http://stinger.actieforum.com

95Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Wed Apr 24, 2019 12:58 pm

RedShot


C-Rank
@Royta/Raeng wrote:Oh the Xbox One X version is the way to go for sure, the dropped inputs are an issue but are nothing compared to the low-framerate the game used to have. Also crashes less (never so far).

I understand, One X version seems the clear winner. I hope they will fix this problem though.

96Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:26 pm

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
Same, it isn't a deal breaker but yesterday I died after a really hard fight just before the savepoint because of it. Really broke my heart.

http://stinger.actieforum.com

97Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Wed Apr 24, 2019 7:20 pm

hedfone

hedfone
C-Rank
The first person does break things, but, people hate twin snakes because Kojima said it sucked or something. Not based off the actually quality or content in the game.

NG- I watched a frame rate comparison and even the S was almost locked 60, while the 360 was hovering in the 40s, it really looked great.

98Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:53 pm

Birdman


Moderator
What's this about dropped inputs?

99Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Thu Apr 25, 2019 7:56 am

Royta/Raeng

Royta/Raeng
Admin
Xbox One drops about 10% of directional inputs, really weird. We're in talks with the team now (or trying to).

http://stinger.actieforum.com

100Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ninja gaiden 2 general discussion. on Fri Apr 26, 2019 7:02 am

Birdman


Moderator
They better fix it or no buy.

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